Pocket 3s early in SnG

C

CfPoker

Rock Star
Joined
Jan 21, 2008
Total posts
332
We're only in Level II here, so don't know much about the villian.

pokerstars Game #17631367283: Tournament #89399068, $5.00+$0.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level II (15/30) - 2008/05/23 - 09:37:47 (ET)
Table '89399068 1' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: The_Wizo (1450 in chips)
Seat 2: klausssss (1195 in chips)
Seat 3: Pappnsae (1205 in chips)
Seat 4: A6player (1200 in chips)
Seat 5: kakka-78 (1845 in chips)
Seat 6: CfPoker333 (1655 in chips)
Seat 7: ota88 (1575 in chips)
Seat 8: rindepelz (1215 in chips)
Seat 9: C-Hillock (2160 in chips)
klausssss: posts small blind 15
Pappnsae: posts big blind 30
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to CfPoker333 [3c 3h]
A6player: folds
kakka-78: folds
CfPoker333: calls 30
ota88: raises 60 to 90
rindepelz: folds
C-Hillock: folds
The_Wizo: folds
klausssss: folds
Pappnsae: folds
CfPoker333: calls 60
set mining
*** FLOP *** [9c 2h Tc]
CfPoker333: checks
i missed
ota88: bets 90
wasn't sure what to make of this. seems a tad small for a cbet, and almost inviting me in if i have a draw, so i doubt he's hit here
CfPoker333: ??
chuck this away, or carry on in some capacity?
 
arahel_jazz

arahel_jazz

Unbalanced and Committed
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6,764
Villan raised pre-flop 3x. Seems to me like he has a couple of paint cards and a draw.

I would toss and wait for better position and cards. I usually only throw the line in once fishing for trips...
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

Is drawing with AK
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Easy/standard fold early on. Sure, most of the time you're hand is good. Problem is, its not *that* good (KQ, ect. have good odds to draw out by the river). And you still have 2 streets of possible betting & scare cards to come on the turn & river.

No sense in getting frisky early on. Just fold.
 
T

ticktockx2

Rising Star
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May 23, 2008
Total posts
2
just fold it..it's still early in the tournament no sense in risking alot on a small pair
 
S93

S93

Legend
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Standard fold. Youre 3´s might be good here but u shouldnt try to find out,your playing these hand for set value..........
 
F

feitr

Legend
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1,570
Fold preflop. You aren't even getting 3:1 to draw to a set, and since it is HU the odds of you actually getting paid off isn't good either. An easy fold on the flop.
 
S93

S93

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Fold preflop. You aren't even getting 3:1 to draw to a set, and since it is HU the odds of you actually getting paid off isn't good either. An easy fold on the flop.
Its obvs. a postflop fold but i dont agree that he should fold preflop.
Its true that he isint geting the 3:1 you talk about BUT its very early in the SNG and this is the chip building time and he haves 50BB so a call is well in order to set mine.
 
F

feitr

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Yea but there isn't any point when you are HU. 1. you get crappy pot odds. 2. you get crappy implied odds because the odds of villain hitting a hand isn't good, unlike if you have a few callers. Soley on pot odds you need 8:1 to draw to a set...now when you factor in implied odds you can obviously draw to a set with much worse pot odds than this, but your implied odds are garbage in this case unless villain has a huge pair or hits TPTK. Even if you hit a set here you aren't likely to get paid off vs one player.
 
WVHillbilly

WVHillbilly

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He's getting implied odds that are plenty good enough to call the raise preflop, but it's a standard fold postflop.

How is a 90 bet into a 165 pot small for a cbet? Looks like it's the perfect size for a tourney cbet and why would he be inviting a draw to stick around if he missed? You're thinking to much. Your thought process should be something like this:

Hmmm...me have little pair in EP, me limp.
Hmmm...me get raised but villain have enough chips to set mine
Hmmm...me miss and he bet so I fold.

It's Caveman Poker.
 
F

feitr

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You might get enough implied odds if villain hits a hand, but in the most likely situation that villain misses (2/3) when you actually hit a set you are probably only gaining a c-bet. 7 x -40 = -280 so in order for this to be 0 EV you have to make 280 chips when you do hit your set....which means you have to be playing for a pot of ~560. This is hardly likely unless you luck out and manage to hit a set when villain has TPTK or an overpair etc. And this is just for 0 EV. Sure if you have another caller it is an auto call because your implied/pot odds go way up, but i don't see the point HU.

Calling 60 raises do add up in SnGs and you don't want to find yourself about 1300 chips or anything. Also in actual HU play (ie. H2H), playing a small pair for set value is incredibly -EV. It is slightly different in this case because it is more likely villain has a good hand so the implied odds go up a little, but i still don't see how this is really a +EV play (unless you know villain is a maniac who will think everybody is bluffing and is willing to shove bluff with A high, or you know that villain is a rock who probably has QQ+ and is unlikely to lay the hand down even to resistance or if you just know villain is willing to stack if they hit TPTK). If you think you have a chance to stack villain if they hit a hand then sure this is probably a +EV play but many players obviously aren't going to stack off on TPTK this early in a SnG.

Still it is pretty marginal...i don't have a problem with the call here for set mining because of how deep everybody is, just making the point that laying this down preflop is fine as well.
 
I

Inscore77

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I might call him in a late stage after I have a read on him, but not here. IMO, he has missed the flop and has over cards, but no need to get into any trouble here
 
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