Pair of kings early on in a SNG

ericgarner118

ericgarner118

Rock Star
Joined
May 23, 2008
Total posts
260
Alright guys here is another hand from a SNG I didn't do to well in again. I've been getting a bit better in cash games, still over all losing though (I think partly cause I can't read people at all yet). Well here's the hand:

pokerstars Game #17688080184: Tournament #89690909, $1.00+$0.20 Hold'em No Limit - Level I (10/20) - 2008/05/25 - 18:04:57 (ET)
Table '89690909 1' 9-max Seat #4 is the button
Seat 1: TNAllison (1500 in chips)
Seat 2: iceman_xddd (1490 in chips)
Seat 3: WHlSKY (1450 in chips)
Seat 4: BreadMan240 (1460 in chips)
Seat 5: FOREE (1480 in chips)
Seat 6: boodreaux54 (1470 in chips)
Seat 7: hammergren l (1340 in chips)
Seat 8: tatitko (1500 in chips)
Seat 9: distrex (1810 in chips)
FOREE: posts small blind 10
boodreaux54: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to distrex [Kd Ks]
hammergren l: folds
tatitko: folds
distrex: raises 140 to 160
TNAllison: folds
iceman_xddd: folds
WHlSKY: folds
BreadMan240: folds
FOREE: folds
boodreaux54: calls 140
*** FLOP *** [9s 8d 2c]
boodreaux54: checks
distrex: bets 260
boodreaux54: calls 260
*** TURN *** [9s 8d 2c] [Jd]
boodreaux54: checks
distrex: bets 220
boodreaux54: raises 460 to 680
distrex: raises 460 to 1140
boodreaux54: calls 370 and is all-in
Uncalled bet (90) returned to distrex
*** RIVER *** [9s 8d 2c Jd] [7s]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
boodreaux54: shows [Qc Ts] (a straight, Eight to Queen)
distrex: shows [Kd Ks] (a pair of Kings)
boodreaux54 collected 2950 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 2950 | Rake 0
Board [9s 8d 2c Jd 7s]
Seat 1: TNAllison folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: iceman_xddd folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: WHlSKY folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: BreadMan240 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: FOREE (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: boodreaux54 (big blind) showed [Qc Ts] and won (2950) with a straight, Eight to Queen
Seat 7: hammergren l folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: tatitko folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: distrex showed [Kd Ks] and lost with a pair of Kings
 
OzExorcist

OzExorcist

Broomcorn's uncle
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OK, a couple of things:

First, if we know the results of a hand it can influence the analysis. So the best thing to do is to only post the history up to the major decision point - in this hand, probably the point you get re-raised on the turn.

Second, the hand itself.

Before the flop, you've got the second best starting hand in the game, and you're in middle position. We'd like to get a bit of action with it. 160 is a really big raise, and it's likely to scare everyone off. If you make it something like 60-80, you'll get callers more consistently and give yourself a better chance to win more than just the blinds.

The flop is OK I think, you're almost certainly ahead but you want to charge straight and flush draws to see the next card. Sets are possible, but you made a pretty big bet before the flop, so it'd be a very loose call for someone to set mine in this spot and the flop has missed the big pairs (JJ+)

Assuming you had the lead on the flop, there are only two or three specific hands that the turn card could have given the lead to: QT, T7 or JJ. You'd think JJ would be the most plausible given the action before the flop, but there's all sorts of other hands that you still beat that call the flop: AKs / AQs / maybe even AJs, QQ, maybe TT and maybe even a weird JTs.

Given that, the fact that you've still got to protect against draws, and the fact that there are some hands that will have improved enough to give you action, but not enough to threaten you, I think we bet and since villain's range is much wider than the three hands that are beating us, I think we call if the villain shoves.

Which is basically what happened - I can see an issue with the bet sizing though. I'd probably have lead for about 500-600 on the turn though, the small bet is just inviting trouble as if the villain is still on a draw, we're offering them very good odds just to call, see the river and maybe fill up their draw.
 
S93

S93

Legend
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Total posts
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PokerStars Game #17688080184: Tournament #89690909, $1.00+$0.20 Hold'em No Limit - Level I (10/20) - 2008/05/25 - 18:04:57 (ET)
Table '89690909 1' 9-max Seat #4 is the button
Seat 1: TNAllison (1500 in chips)
Seat 2: iceman_xddd (1490 in chips)
Seat 3: WHlSKY (1450 in chips)
Seat 4: BreadMan240 (1460 in chips)
Seat 5: FOREE (1480 in chips)
Seat 6: boodreaux54 (1470 in chips)
Seat 7: hammergren l (1340 in chips)
Seat 8: tatitko (1500 in chips)
Seat 9: distrex (1810 in chips)
FOREE: posts small blind 10
boodreaux54: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to distrex [Kd Ks]
hammergren l: folds
tatitko: folds
distrex: raises 140 to 160 This is a really big raise,u should find out what u whant u standard raise to be and stick to it.Having a standard raise also makes it harder to read u(if u allways raise 2BB with a bad hand and 8BB with a good one vilians will pick up on that). A standard pre flop raise is usually 3-4xBB+1BB per limper so raiseing to 60-80 whould be a standard raise here.
TNAllison: folds
iceman_xddd: folds
WHlSKY: folds
BreadMan240: folds
FOREE: folds
boodreaux54: calls 140
*** FLOP *** [9s 8d 2c]
boodreaux54: checks
distrex: bets 260 I like this bet,its a strong c-bet at just about the right size for a 330pot or roughly 70-80% of the pot
boodreaux54: calls 260
*** TURN *** [9s 8d 2c] J♦
boodreaux54: checks
distrex: bets 220 After the Jack of D comes on the turn this bord is draw heavy you whant to bet more here so you dont give flush/straight draws the right pot odds. the pot is around 850 so u whant to bet out atleast 500 here.
boodreaux54: raises 460 to 680 Here u really have to think what your oponent haves and try to figure how much of his range your ahead of. Like Oz pointed out whe are ahead of his range so i think a push is the right move.
distrex: raises 460 to 1140
boodreaux54: calls 370 and is all-in
Uncalled bet (90) returned to distrex
*** RIVER *** [9s 8d 2c Jd] 7♠
*** SHOW DOWN ***
boodreaux54: shows [Qc Ts] (a straight, Eight to Queen)
distrex: shows [Kd Ks] (a pair of Kings)
boodreaux54 collected 2950 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 2950 | Rake 0
Board [9s 8d 2c Jd 7s]
Seat 1: TNAllison folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: iceman_xddd folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: WHlSKY folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: BreadMan240 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: FOREE (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: boodreaux54 (big blind) showed [Qc Ts] and won (2950) with a straight, Eight to Queen
Seat 7: hammergren l folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: tatitko folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: distrex showed [Kd Ks] and lost with a pair of Kings

The all-in whas not a bad move i think alot of the time the vilian will have some thing like AJ or a combo draw so there is nothing wrong with this.
The things i whould look at in this hand is the preflop raise and the turn bet.
And like Oz sayed try not to post the reasults since it scews the anlysis,just post the hand up to the turn re-raise for example or the hole hand with out showing vilians hand.
 
AZE

AZE

DC Coach
Joined
Jul 7, 2007
Total posts
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convert your hands, take out results, bet more on flop, bet more on turn have a good day.
 
S93

S93

Legend
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convert your hands, take out results, bet more on flop, bet more on turn have a good day.
Whats wrong with the flop bet? It looks to be like a standard c-bet.....
 
AZE

AZE

DC Coach
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Total posts
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For some reason I saw flop as 89J with two diamonds.

Which should only reinforce my first statement... convert your hands.
 
robwhufc

robwhufc

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May 25, 2005
Total posts
5,587
As per other replies, raise less pre-flop.

Post flop, you can't put opponent on Q 10, that was just ridiculous. AA and JJ would fit, 88 and 99 possibly, but that's only 4 so you cant really consider folding this at any stage.


convert your hands.

I hate the converted hands (especially Cardschat's one). You should be able to read this ok.
 
D

DukeDrew

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May 13, 2006
Total posts
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Oz, I'm with Rob on this one. QT off calling a 8xBB pre-flop raise and then calling a significant bet (260/330) post-flop... with 2 mediocre overcards? Was villain hoping to hit a gut shot? (apparently so! lol) But how realistic is that? Even if he thinks hero is Ax and missed, he's still behind with not a lot of hope.

FWIW - I think the pre-flop raise was a bit much. That said, you're in a $1 game. It's like playing $.05/$.1 NL; logic does not apply.
 
joker131

joker131

Visionary
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Sep 6, 2006
Total posts
706
bet the pot

if u had bet the pot after the flop , i think he would have folded with just a inside draw. if im in the lead after the flop, its a really big raise or all in for me, u have won plenty of chips from before the flop to chance another card throwing up trips or a flush draw.
 
OzExorcist

OzExorcist

Broomcorn's uncle
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Total posts
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Oz, I'm with Rob on this one. QT off calling a 8xBB pre-flop raise and then calling a significant bet (260/330) post-flop... with 2 mediocre overcards? Was villain hoping to hit a gut shot?

That was exactly my point - QT (and T7) would be ahead of us, but they're so unlikely that we shouldn't be worried about them.
 
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