$ NL HE MTT: $ NL HE MTT: Facing a Donk bet with middle pair

[tzuriel]

Game

Hold'em

Game Format

No Limit

Table Format

MTT

Freeroll

1. Freeroll

Currency

$

I 3bet a limp from UTG2 and I hit middle pair on the flop. This flop hits my range better than theirs, I think, and they donk bet and I call. I call down to find they hit 2 pair on the turn. Should I raise that donk bet? What else should I have done differently here? Bigger 3bet PF?


NL Holdem $0+$0 (2400.00BB)
EP (17.4BBs) [VPIP: 21.4% | PFR: 14.3% | AGG: 16.7% | hands: 14]
MP1 (69BBs) [VPIP: 25% | PFR: 0% | AGG: 33.3% | Hands: 21]

HERO (108.1BBs)

Dealt to Hero: Q♥ K♣

UTG Folds, EP Folds, MP1 Calls 1BBs, MP2 Folds, HJ Folds, HERO Raises To 4.6BBs, BTN Folds, SB Folds, BB Folds, MP1 Calls 3.5BBs

Hero SPR on Flop: [5.65 effective]
Flop (11.4BBs): Q♦ A♦ 2♠
MP1 Bets 2.9BBs (Rem. Stack: 61.5BBs), HERO Calls 2.9BBs (Rem. Stack: 100.7BBs)

Turn (17.1BBs): Q♦ A♦ 2♠ J♣
MP1 Bets 12.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 48.7BBs), HERO Calls 12.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 87.9BBs)

River (42.8BBs): Q♦ A♦ 2♠ J♣ 9♥
MP1 Bets 10.7BBs (Rem. Stack: 38BBs), HERO Calls 10.7BBs (Rem. Stack: 77.2BBs)

Spoiler

MP1 shows: Q♣ J♦

MP1 wins: 64.1BBs

 

[fundiver199]

Preflop
Standard spot to isolate the limper, and given how deep you are, I think, its fine to go large, like you did.

Flop
Folding second pair to a small donk bet is way to tight, but I also think, your hand is to in between to raise. If you raise here, he is likely not folding any better hand, and he is also not calling with to many worse hands except maybe a flushdraw.

Turn
The J is not a complete brick, since it bring in hands like KT and QJ, which he can definitely have. He is also betting much bigger now. Still not really big, but big compared to, what he was doing on the flop. Here we need to look a little at the player type. This is someone, who limp-called in this hand, and in 21 hands he have never raised preflop. So clearly this is a passive recreational player AKA "fish" or "whale", and the strategy used by such players is usually to try to make a hand and then get paid.

So even though he could in theory still have a hand like a flushdraw, I think, this sizing is skewed towards strong hands. If he had a draw or a weak made hand like QT, he would likely either check or bet small again and try to see the next card for cheap. So my first thought here is, that I dont think, you have the best hand against this kind of opponent taking this kind of line. You do have 9 cards, that will improve you though, so the question is, if it makes sense to call here to basically draw. And I think, the answer is no. You are not getting the correct direct odds to do so, so you need some implied odds on the river to justify calling a turn bet this large to draw. And here I dont really think, you have them.

Any T will give you a broadway straight, which is likely the best hand, but there will be a 1-liner to a straight, which makes it difficult to get paid, and sometimes you will only chop with another K. Any K will give you two pair, but there will also be a 1-liner to a straight, so your hand will not even be strong enough to bluffcatch the river. Realistically the best, you are hoping for, is, that he check, and then you can check back and beat a worse hand like top pair bad kicker. Any Q will give you trips, which is probably the hand most likely to get paid by worse, but there are only 2 Qs left in the deck.

And finally 3 of your outs will put out a possible flush, which he could sometimes have, and if he dont, it will be scary to him. So I prefer to just fold here. It might be slightly exploitable, but I dont think, a player like this is going to exploit you. As I said already, he is focused on making hands and getting paid, not by finding spots, where he can make some amazing multistreet bluff against an opponent, who overfold to big turn or river bet.

River
Now he sizes down, which dont make a ton of sense, and I have no idea, what kind of hand to put him on. But you are getting 5:1, so as played I would also stick in the call and get to showdown.

Spoiler
So he had QJ. That makes sense until the turn, but no idea, why he sized down on the river. If you fold the turn, you wont have any headache on the river, and you save some chips in the long run