How can u call this?

bob_tiger

bob_tiger

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Stacks:
* MP with 36440
* mmfvcr with 49278
* BTN with 21530
* SB with 68928
* BB with 51604
* UTG with 42220

hand.pl


hand.pl

Blinds:
Site: full tilt poker
* * Dealt to BB:4♥ 4♦
* * Sklansky group 7
Preflop:
* * 1 players fold.
* * MP calls [5,000]
* * 3 players fold.
Hero raises to 51,004, and is all in
* * MP calls [30,840] [ all-in ] Hero shows : 4♥ 4♦
* * MP shows : 6♦ 5♦ Uncalled bet of 15,164 returned to Hero
* * Total folds this street: 4
* * Potsize: 86846
Flop: A♥ 9♠ 9♦
* * Potsize: 86846
Turn: 3♣
* * Potsize: 86846
River: A♣
* * Hero shows two pair, Aces and Nines
* * MP shows two pair, Aces and Nines
* * MP wins the pot (77,780) with two pair, Aces and Nines

Poker Hand Converter By Cardschat.com Poker Forum


btw i took 5th place after i had to shove with A4 on button and ran in to AQ and lost obv. same guy tat had 65 this hand took me out lol
 
pantin007

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could have been a misclick or he had to leave the to go somewhere and wanted to lose his chips fast
donk play tho, tuff one bob
 
pokerace3454

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he leaving he going. he could just sit out
 
Jillychemung

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Guess he loves suited connectors and just felt like gambling.
 
P

p0K35

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who goes allin with pp4 on the BB?

may be my first post, but why are you pushing here, what 50k into a 12k pot with pp4? you can check a free flop, and make a play then?

bad call, granted, but could you justify your play please...
 
bob_tiger

bob_tiger

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yes i can see your point but answer is very simple, first of all i was playing tight, using my image second of all i wanted to take the blinds preflop and if flop comes something like A K 10 lets say for example and i miss it, Im out of position and cant really make a play it since he limped in with it preflop. I'm not mad at coinflip thats what i was hoping for but calling with 56 is a bit fishy to me and he wasnt forced to call that with his stack.
 
C

CfPoker

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The push is fine. It's likely to be better than what MP is holding. If MP folds we've just won 12,500. If he calls we're hopefully getting a coinflip to knock him out.
 
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p0K35

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ok, let's try this again.

Looks like blinds are 2500/500, so nobody is in good shape here, and I'll assume this is deep into the tourney, perhaps final tbl(doubtful), or near bubble??? But here is where every spot is crucial. So:

Stealing the blinds, ok, acceptable move, but how did that work out? and from the BB? Did you and tight tbl image try that stealing blinds move in the past few orbits? ...

Your 2nd in chips at a short-handed tbl, I would tread softly, why look for a coin-flip? I want a distinct advantage, as the shorter stacks battle? Why get crippled here?

48.51% { 6d5d }
49.38% { 4d4h }

pp4 has absolutely NO showdown advantage/value (ok, little, as 23o may call you), as you see in this hand where you get counterfeited. Post back and I can explain what that means...

IF you think this a good 'stealing the blinds' move, there is always the 'stop and go', just check, allin on flop, and your position works for you. IF 65d calls that(they won't), well, we have a post to discuss..
 
bob_tiger

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ok lets try it again then. First of all you do not see my point at all. He limped in with 56h suited connectors with 3 players to act after him and then he calls all in of somebody tight as me. there was no way he knew it was a coin flip situation, I could of had 55 or 66 and he would of been crushed, even if i dont have pp lets say i have something like AJ for example, you really think he made a good play hoping for 60/40?

This is a final table of 3.30 90 man 9 places get paid, I have little over 100% roi in these so let that speak for itself.

Ok now 2nd part if i check, how does my position work for me? I'm first to act, I'm not going all in on that flop, I will give him credit for A rag at least and check to him, here he will obv bet and take it down. You are missing the whole point of this thread. On the flop i cant put him on 56 thats the problem, it would be very hard even for a pro to put him on 56 on the flop, yes it is possible to make a read that he has a flush draw and push but at this level he is most likely to call and why risk with such a flop?

I know what counterfeited means if thats what you are trying to say, I'm not stupid, so when you post there is no need to be a smart azz about it. Make your point but dont be rude, ty.
 
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p0K35

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ok, I'm done here. but let's retort:

ok lets try it again then. First of all you do not see my point at all. He limped in with 56h suited connectors with 3 players to act after him and then he calls all in of somebody tight as me.

posting this move, shows how good a tbl image you have...

Ok now 2nd part if i check, how does my position work for me?

How did the preflop allin work? It didn't.

After flop, you first to act, allin would probably work now. or not...

I think you made a bad move, that is all.
 
bob_tiger

bob_tiger

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Learn how to read please, On the flop I'm out of position, I'm not going all in on that flop. Ok wait, lets say i do check, now I dont know what he has, This late in the tourney I'm going to think A rag, QK something like that right? I'm obv not going to push all in on the flop if i think he has A rag, after i check to him he is going to bet and take this from me because I have no idea he limped in with 56h, thus im giving away my bb, the chances of me hitting 4 are very small and there is most likely going to be an over card on the flop which will make my decisions harder. Please read, I understand that this is not how you would handle it, but this is a turbo so I need to be aggresive and I'm willing to take a coin flip here, I'm just disgusted he is willing to risk his whole stack on 56 here when he is not a SS and he doesnt need to make a move with 56.
 
X

xXcRaZyBiRdXx

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I agree with you. He made a "bad call". He must of just fealt like gambling and maybe 56 is his/her favorite or lucky hand. They were probably born in 1965 and their birthstone is the diamond. I don't think I push in your situation though. But I wasn't there. Sometimes the table dictates the move. GL2U
 
KerouacsDog

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I know what counterfeited means if thats what you are trying to say, I'm not stupid, so when you post there is no need to be a smart azz about it. Make your point but dont be rude, ty.
I dont think he was being rude, or a smart azz, i think he was being helpfull, as not everyone is aware what counterfeiting means.
Anyway, you asked why he called with 65? I have no idea, but he did, and got very lucky against your 44. We do not know why some people play hands like that, but they do. My advice? Add him to your buddy list, and when he's next on, take him down, he sounds like a fish, and you're better than that, you're a CCer, that counts for something in poker.
As for my play in that situation, i think I would have checked and seen the flop. then check the flop, if he bets, I fold, and still have an ok stack in relation to the other players. If he checks, then i bet the turn.
 
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p0K35

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ok, I missed something here. I won't even quote. But I have one final ?

I know you lost the hand, and may want to vent, but, seriously, how well do you think you played that hand, on a tourney level? Let's go 1-10 scale...

I'm not defending MP, in any manner, but just curious, why you protest so much...

Knowing the outcome, makes this moot, but the 'stop-n-go', does work, sometimes better than an allin.
 
chikiloka

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lol, retard, jajajjaa, they says "pot odds" or "had to do it", jajajaa:eek:
 
widowmaker89

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Are you seriously suggesting he should have checked and went all in with an A on the board? Its quite easy to make a case seeing the hand but come on.

You cant tread softly in a short handed table with an M of 7. Second in chips doesnt really matter here since he is barely second and more importantly his M is 7, you tread softly you pick up a hand double up and are still below where you were to begin with. His effective M is even lower since its short handed. MP showed weakness and this was a good time to take down a nice pot.

Im not saying this is a for sure push, but if he figured he had a tight table image its a good move, its not even a bad move if its not. Most people fold a lot of hands from MP here wanting to move up the latter.

And just because a move didnt work doesnt mean it was a bad move Pok, really cant judge based on results.

Also, I notice if you play by the same name that you dont play MTT and only a handful on SNG. MTT is a different beast than cash so it wouldnt be advisable there.
 
S

switch0723

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I THINK he was just about getting odds to call if he put you on 2 overcards
 
S

sin2win

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it was a bad call but when the cards were turned over, he made a very good call looks like, a flip. u wouldnt even be in that position if u didnt overplay ure poc 4s
 
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p0K35

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Are you seriously suggesting he should have checked and went all in with an A on the board? Its quite easy to make a case seeing the hand but come on.

No, I'm suggesting the preflop allin isn't a good move, and didn't work out so well. Understand the move, before you make the move that cripples you. And when it does, don't complain. You made a move, you got picked off, somewhat suspiciously, but picked off nonetheless...

The allin with pp4 eliminates any other play/move in this hand, so throw the stopngo out the window, DNE...

You cant tread softly in a short handed table with an M of 7. Second in chips doesnt really matter here since he is barely second and more importantly his M is 7, you tread softly you pick up a hand double up and are still below where you were to begin with. His effective M is even lower since its short handed. MP showed weakness and this was a good time to take down a nice pot.

Sure you can, and should, why try wonky allin moves with pp4 here, and get crippled? Perhaps, make better plays earlier, and have a bigger stack???

Im not saying this is a for sure push, but if he figured he had a tight table image its a good move, its not even a bad move if its not. Most people fold a lot of hands from MP here wanting to move up the latter.

ok, this is a real funky HH, so , ok.

And just because a move didnt work doesnt mean it was a bad move Pok, really cant judge based on results.

Fair enuff, but IMO, poor move...

Also, I notice if you play by the same name that you dont play MTT and only a handful on SNG. MTT is a different beast than cash so it wouldnt be advisable there.

That is interesting, as any SNG, can be a MTT, or a STT, no tourney is technically a 'cash game'...
 
widowmaker89

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What I meant is you dont play SNG or tournys and they are quite different than cash game, not referring to either one as a cash game.

Saying have more chips is all fine and dandy but if thats your arguement its a poor one. Also it has more to do with tourny structure than it does chip stacks since, like you mentioned, he was in second but still an M of 7.

You really cannot sit back and wait, and there is a great chance he is ahead in this hand the push is fine. Anyone set mining at this point is making a terrible mistake since the implied odds arent there so I would say this move results in a fold almost everytime, adding 25% to his stack. You cannot sit and wait for a premium hand anymore. Think of it this way, if he wins this on a fold(usually will) his stack size will be about 59k. if he waits and gets AA in 15 hands and doubles up he will be at about the same amount.

At this stage in the game most of the play is preflop. Cash game is the complete opposite, and I do not know if you are a cash player but that would make sense. any PP is good PF but gets very dicey on any flop and this is a very reasonable play.
 
zachvac

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[x] standard push
[x] marginal call
[ ] bad beat
 
bob_tiger

bob_tiger

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Ok i want to make an outline of everything to pok, first of all I'm not mad that I lost the coin flip, what surprises me is the call with 56 and there is no way in the world he knew I had 44 or 33 or 22. Yes He might of thought i had two overcards and decided he would take 60/40 which I think would be a bad decision but we all have a different point of view on poker. Personally I think this guy limping in in that position and making that call was a poor play. I'm not saying my play was perfect, like I said there is no perfect in poker.
Also like zachvac has said this is a standard push, many people would make this play and I'm sure by the way everybody was playing at the table, I didn't see this guy make any crazy plays and was playing pretty tight at the time so I dont know why all of sudden he limped in and made that call. Ok back to what i was saying, in this case I put him on overcards something like Ax or QK, in that range basically, obviously he would most likely raise with pp with these blinds since this is a 90 player turbo sng. Pok I was out of position and with A 9 9 on flop, lets say i did check, I wouldnt push, 1- im out of position, first to act 2-I would probably give him the credit for limping in with Ax and he would take that pot from me. Also after you already see the results its very easy to say that he made a good call and I made a poor play but I disagree, what would you do there not knowing he has 56, check and go all in out of position with two overcards...ya right I dont think so. Also I never said it was a bad beat, I was just a bit disgusted with the call and the outcome, thats all.
 
zachvac

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ok he played this hand horribly. If you were both good poker players I'm pretty sure he would have open shoved, then you would have folded, your FE removed and hoping to be at best flipping and possibly dominated. But you're basically shoving ATC and if this is in fact your range he made the correct call, because it's 56-44 in the random hand's favor, his limp has priced him in. Limping with stacks this short with a hand like that is pretty horrible, but he made a bad play, it happens in poker, it's how we make money.
 
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