$Freeroll NLHE MTT: What cruelty to flirt AQo SB

I Live Poker

I Live Poker

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I thought a lot about giving up because of the bubble and being out of position, but my image was good. I would have the chance of shovy but I discarded because of the bubble and for being short stack and not putting pressure on opponents. But anyway I was very stupid in this hand for two reasons. First lack of attention:
I didn't notice the big stack until he called my allin, I thought I was shoving from LID nor did I notice his check flop. So this erroneous reaction as a short as I had only flipped in early positions took him out of the range of Aces, even more who opened two aces on the flop.
And the second mistake was lack of attention:D as well: The statistics of the super NIT and without aggression factor and the went to show dawn of 50 and 99 of victories in the showdawn ... him in hand ...

Winning Poker, Hold'em No Limit - 150/300 (30 ante) - 8 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat

AllinIgorM (UTG): 9,325 (31 bb)
1MilhaoSemNada (UTG+1): 4,305 (14 bb)
Matiusa_94 (MP): 10,677 (36 bb)
cris64 (MP+1): 5,813 (19 bb)
Sdub2020 (CO): 23,317 (78 bb)
EverLast11 (BU): 4,822 (16 bb)
_snowball_ (SB): 8,035 (27 bb)
kiwiwizard (BB): 5,063 (17 bb)

Pre-Flop: (690) Hero (1MilhaoSemNada) is UTG+1 with 5 5
1 fold, 1MilhaoSemNada (UTG+1) raises to 600, 1 fold, cris64 (MP+1) calls 600, 2 players fold, _snowball_ (SB) calls 450, 1 fold

Flop: (2,340) 2 4 A (3 players)
_snowball_ (SB) checks, 1MilhaoSemNada (UTG+1) bets 3,675 (all-in), cris64 (MP+1) folds, _snowball_ (SB) calls 3,675

Turn: (9,690) K (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: (9,690) A (2 players, 1 all-in)

Total pot: 9,690

Showdown:
1MilhaoSemNada (UTG+1) shows 5 5 (two pair, Aces and Fives)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 54%, Flop: 24%, Turn: 11%, River: 0%)

_snowball_ (SB) shows Q A (three of a kind, Aces)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 46%, Flop: 76%, Turn: 89%, River: 100%)

_snowball_ (SB) wins 9,690
 
F

fundiver199

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With 14BB I would only play push or fold, and especially with a hand like 55, which play very poorly postflop with a low SPR. Its not a problem to open jam as a short stack, since bigger stacks still cant call you with random garbage, if they are trying to play well. Say for instance that MP with 36BB looks down at a decent but not great hand like AJo. Then he pretty much has to fold, because if he gives action, he is risking his entire 36BB stack against some of the players behind.

However with this being on the bubble, I would tighten up and simply fold the small pairs from EP. Some players feel, its to tight to open fold a pair preflop, but its really not. On Sunday Million final tables I have seen people open fold 22 or 33 from BTN, because stack sizes were to deep to open jam and not deep enough to play it as a setmine. And in this particular situation I think, you had an easy fold as well. I would probably want 77 or better to get involved here, and then I would open jam.
 
erik_lima

erik_lima

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55 with 14bb on Early Position is an easy fold, specially on bubble time.
 
F

fundiver199

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Just for the record I dont love postflop either, but you kind of said that yourself already. Its a rough spot seeing a flop with an SPR of around 1,5, when you have a hand like 55. Unless you flop a set, there are always going to be overcards, and more overcards will usually come on the turn and river. So its difficult to get to showdown and realise the value of your hand. And this is exactly why, you dont want to create that situation in the first place.

But as played I guess, I will check and hope, they are very passive and will allow me to see a cheap showdown. Or that I bink a 3 or a 5 on the turn improving my hand. When you jam it all in on the flop, I expect a result like this a very non zero percent of the time. Especially on a A high board, because people just love to play aces. I would be much more on board with this move on a texture like 642 or 742, where its kind of unlikely, someone hit top pair, and if they did, then good for them.
 
Collin Moshman

Collin Moshman

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Fundiver is right that this is a shove-fold spot.

In general:

With 15bb or smaller effective stack, any low-mid pocket pair is a shove or fold.

(With a high pocket pair, you might sometimes min-raise to induce.)

The reason is that these hands don't play well but still have good equity if called in a pre-flop all-in since they're usually flipping.

In this specific spot, I would shove. It's the bubble but you're the short stack so I like shoving pre-flop to stay alive and start building up your stack.
 
D

Dinam1488

Rising Star
With 14BB I would only play push or fold, and especially with a hand like 55, which play very poorly postflop with a low SPR. Its not a problem to open jam as a short stack, since bigger stacks still cant call you with random garbage, if they are trying to play well. Say for instance that MP with 36BB looks down at a decent but not great hand like AJo. Then he pretty much has to fold, because if he gives action, he is risking his entire 36BB stack against some of the players behind.

However with this being on the bubble, I would tighten up and simply fold the small pairs from EP. Some players feel, its to tight to open fold a pair preflop, but its really not. On Sunday Million final tables I have seen people open fold 22 or 33 from BTN, because stack sizes were to deep to open jam and not deep enough to play it as a setmine. And in this particular situation I think, you had an easy fold as well. I would probably want 77 or better to get involved here, and then I would open jam.
Agree
 
F

fundiver199

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In this specific spot, I would shove. It's the bubble but you're the short stack so I like shoving pre-flop to stay alive and start building up your stack.

I can certainly see both shoving and folding being reasonable options here, and I would much rather shove than min-raise. Just to make people think a little more deeply about the situation here is my list of things going into the decision making process:

* What are the stack sizes on the other tables? If someone is running on fumes and will get hit by the blinds shortly, I would lean more towards folding, because then the bubble might be just about to burst.

* What are the table dynamics? Are people still playing wild, or have most of them nitted up trying to secure the min-cash? With a hand like 55 we clearly want folds, so its way better to jam, if the table has nitted up. We dont want to jam here and then have big blind look down at 87s and press the "call" button, because his hand looks to pretty for him to fold.

* How significant is the min-cash? This will depend on the tournament structure, and even within the same poker site there are differences.

* Since this is a freeroll, optimizing time can be more valuable than optimizing ROI, and you might simply choose to not even care about a min-cash but go solely after reaching the final table. In which case this is then a clear jam. Even in normal tournaments there is value in becoming a big stack, so you can push shorter stacks around, and this is not factored into normal ICM calculations.
 
I Live Poker

I Live Poker

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With 14BB I would only play push or fold, and especially with a hand like 55, which play very poorly postflop with a low SPR. Its not a problem to open jam as a short stack, since bigger stacks still cant call you with random garbage, if they are trying to play well. Say for instance that MP with 36BB looks down at a decent but not great hand like AJo. Then he pretty much has to fold, because if he gives action, he is risking his entire 36BB stack against some of the players behind.

However with this being on the bubble, I would tighten up and simply fold the small pairs from EP. Some players feel, its to tight to open fold a pair preflop, but its really not. On Sunday Million final tables I have seen people open fold 22 or 33 from BTN, because stack sizes were to deep to open jam and not deep enough to play it as a setmine. And in this particular situation I think, you had an easy fold as well. I would probably want 77 or better to get involved here, and then I would open jam.

Yes I agree. thanks for your answer.!
My reason clearly told me to fold, but I wanted to invent ... the table was also good and the game was so well studied, and respectful. Which at the time seemed like a way, but the villain played very well ...
 
I Live Poker

I Live Poker

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Just for the record I dont love postflop either, but you kind of said that yourself already. Its a rough spot seeing a flop with an SPR of around 1,5, when you have a hand like 55. Unless you flop a set, there are always going to be overcards, and more overcards will usually come on the turn and river. So its difficult to get to showdown and realise the value of your hand. And this is exactly why, you dont want to create that situation in the first place.

But as played I guess, I will check and hope, they are very passive and will allow me to see a cheap showdown. Or that I bink a 3 or a 5 on the turn improving my hand. When you jam it all in on the flop, I expect a result like this a very non zero percent of the time. Especially on a A high board, because people just love to play aces. I would be much more on board with this move on a texture like 642 or 742, where its kind of unlikely, someone hit top pair, and if they did, then good for them.



Yes, I totally agree, but I also have the issue of my lack of attention, because I thought I was playing only with shorts until I realized the villain's last call ... I hadn't even noticed the check ...
But in general I will adopt the posture that you said 77+ shovy the rest of the pairs is fold. It looks great to me. I decided to show this hand because of the mistakes.
 
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