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Was he floating a K here? I checked back on the river because it was a terrible card for my hand. Would you have value bet this river?

NL Holdem (80.00BB)
BTN ($8653)
SB ($7362)
BB ($8178)
UTG ($3433)
HJ ($13081)
HERO ($4976)

Dealt to Hero: 9♠ 9♥

UTG Folds, HJ Calls $80, HERO Raises To $280, BTN Folds, SB Folds, BB Folds, HJ Calls $200

Hero SPR on Flop: [6.91 effective]
Flop ($680): J♦ 2♠ Q♥
HJ Checks, HERO Bets $680 (Rem. Stack: $4016), HJ Calls $680 (Rem. Stack: $12121)

Turn ($2040): J♦ 2♠ Q♥ 9♦
HJ Checks, HERO Bets $590 (Rem. Stack: $3426), HJ Calls $590 (Rem. Stack: $11531)

River ($3220): J♦ 2♠ Q♥ 9♦ T♥
HJ Checks, HERO Checks

Spoiler alert!

Click to Reveal!

HJ shows: J♣ 5♠

HERO wins: $3220

Pre flop varies to me here depending on who I have behind me and whether or not this was pre ante (which I think it is based on what you posted) and also how likely am I to get a call from the limper. In a freeroll I expect few people to fold pre once they vpip. So I dont mind the raise but in a freeroll, pre ante, and no one behind me that is aggro I dont mind just over limping here and set mining. In freerolls I would expect a lot of people to call my raise behind and the initial limper to call as well making it a 4 way pot or so with 99. I would almost rather just see the flop and make it large when I want to make it large. However you raise and get the result you want which is only one caller. I know what I put is against the grain with 99 and just noting that is it is only freeroll specific, pre ante and also with no aggs behind me.

On the flop, I dont get betting pot when there are two overcards. In a freeroll you arent getting a lot of hands to fold that you are beating and now if you are beat you will be losing more chips than you need to. I would probably c bet if I raised pre just to pot control in a sense that I expect villain would call and then check turn which I could then check behind. My bet would be small, somewhere around 40% of pot but I could also see checking behind here as a viable option.

On the turn as played you hit your card and then all the sudden bet 1/4th pot. I dont get this move. Now we want to extract value from all the one pair hands that villain called the flop with. They could have K10 (would be a bad flop call) but I doubt it and much more likely they have a one pair hand here which now you can really capitalize on since you bet too large on the flop. Here I like a large bet sizing, something around 2/3rds but at least half pot to get value. As of now I would be planning on a river jam and the more we bet on the turn, the easier the call is when we get it in on the river and if villain folds to the jam then we at least got two very healthy streets.

The river is a bad card but as played I am not sure villain is checking a straight on this river after we just looked weak on the turn and bet small. I would think they would lead here, especially in a freeroll so even though I am a bit nervous about it, I think I would bet here. I dont see the reason to jam since one pair hands should now fold so I would bet pretty small here (maybe like 1/3rd pot) and just see if I can get a crying call from a one pair hand or a hand now that could have become 2 pair.

Originally Posted by 300HPGOD

Pre flop varies to me here depending on who I have behind me and whether or not this was pre ante (which I think it is based on what you posted) and also how likely am I to get a call from the limper. In a freeroll I expect few people to fold pre once they vpip. So I dont mind the raise but in a freeroll, pre ante, and no one behind me that is aggro I dont mind just over limping here and set mining. In freerolls I would expect a lot of people to call my raise behind and the initial limper to call as well making it a 4 way pot or so with 99. I would almost rather just see the flop and make it large when I want to make it large. However you raise and get the result you want which is only one caller. I know what I put is against the grain with 99 and just noting that is it is only freeroll specific, pre ante and also with no aggs behind me.

On the flop, I dont get betting pot when there are two overcards. In a freeroll you arent getting a lot of hands to fold that you are beating and now if you are beat you will be losing more chips than you need to. I would probably c bet if I raised pre just to pot control in a sense that I expect villain would call and then check turn which I could then check behind. My bet would be small, somewhere around 40% of pot but I could also see checking behind here as a viable option.

On the turn as played you hit your card and then all the sudden bet 1/4th pot. I dont get this move. Now we want to extract value from all the one pair hands that villain called the flop with. They could have K10 (would be a bad flop call) but I doubt it and much more likely they have a one pair hand here which now you can really capitalize on since you bet too large on the flop. Here I like a large bet sizing, something around 2/3rds but at least half pot to get value. As of now I would be planning on a river jam and the more we bet on the turn, the easier the call is when we get it in on the river and if villain folds to the jam then we at least got two very healthy streets.

The river is a bad card but as played I am not sure villain is checking a straight on this river after we just looked weak on the turn and bet small. I would think they would lead here, especially in a freeroll so even though I am a bit nervous about it, I think I would bet here. I dont see the reason to jam since one pair hands should now fold so I would bet pretty small here (maybe like 1/3rd pot) and just see if I can get a crying call from a one pair hand or a hand now that could have become 2 pair.

Thank you. I am still learning when to make what size bets. This will help me understand it better.

Preflop
I like the isolation, but its a bit small. Typically I go to at least 4BB against one limper.

Flop
I would check back here. If you bet and especially such a large bet, you get all better hands to call and most worse hands to fold. You are almost turning your hand into a bluff, since some players might actually fold a J to your sizing. If you are going to bet at all, it needs to be much smaller like 30% pot.

Turn
You improved to a set, and now you bet very small. This is totally backwards. As played you should bet a size now, which allow you to jam any clean river card like 60-70% pot.

River
I am also checking back here. Any K or 8 has a straight now. Not only does that make it much more likely, you are beat, it also makes it more difficult to get called by worse. Maybe a small bet can get called by some two pair and what not. But the issue is, you will reopen the betting, and if he raise, you have to fold.

Preflop: Good isolate. In tournaments in general you want to raise smaller, because of shallower stacks. But here effective stacks are 80bbs, so you can raise 3.5x-4x.

Flop: This board is very good for you. You have QQ-JJ, overpairs, two pairs and good top pairs in your range. For this reason I think you should just range bet small, like 33%. However, if you want to split your range and use a bigger sizing you should check back 99. Villain is not folding better hands and not calling with worse. Very bad sizing with your hand. And remember, in 3bet pots you don't need to use big sizes, especially in position, because you can get all the money in anyway.

Turn: As played, you hit your set and have this very draw heavy board. Villain have a lot of flush draws, pair+gutshots and top pairs, so you should charge bigger. Your quarter pot bet is very bad, you are giving very great price to his draws. Would go 66%.

River: This spot is super villain dependant. Some villains never donk and have all straights in their range, while others always donk straights here. Also, when you bet some villains never raise bluff, while others might bluff check-raise here. If villain is passive I would bet small and fold to raise, and I think this is what you should do by default. If villain is very aggressive, then you can check back.

Overall, very poorly played, because you made mistakes on every street.

On the flop you missed set and broadway cards defenitely in his range. Pot bet is very large. Half pot or check is good enough.

On tern bet at least 75% of pot.

On river i would check or bet/fold something like 1/3 of pot

Originally Posted by tzuriel

Hand History driven straight to this forum with DriveHUD http://drivehud.com/?t=hh and Database Software

Was he floating a K here? I checked back on the river because it was a terrible card for my hand. Would you have value bet this river?

NL Holdem (80.00BB)
BTN ($8653)
SB ($7362)
BB ($8178)
UTG ($3433)
HJ ($13081)
HERO ($4976)

Dealt to Hero: 9♠ 9♥

UTG Folds, HJ Calls $80, HERO Raises To $280, BTN Folds, SB Folds, BB Folds, HJ Calls $200

Hero SPR on Flop: [6.91 effective]
Flop ($680): J♦ 2♠ Q♥
HJ Checks, HERO Bets $680 (Rem. Stack: $4016), HJ Calls $680 (Rem. Stack: $12121)

Turn ($2040): J♦ 2♠ Q♥ 9♦
HJ Checks, HERO Bets $590 (Rem. Stack: $3426), HJ Calls $590 (Rem. Stack: $11531)

River ($3220): J♦ 2♠ Q♥ 9♦ T♥
HJ Checks, HERO Checks

Spoiler alert!

Click to Reveal!

HJ shows: J♣ 5♠

HERO wins: $3220

Thank you for posting

Preflop any reads on this V's playing style as the river showdown suggest weak passive did you know that preflop?

Flop nails a weak passive players range so why are we betting pot? We get all the weak stuff to fold and the made hands and good draws to call with this sizing. Which is exactly what happened and your error was hidden by the runout.

You may wish to make your learning points of focus the following:

1 Player reads-this allows us to range our villain more accurately.
We do this with HUD's and learning to make effective player notes and versus unknowns using our notes on other players to recognize player pool tendencies.
Such as when a player limps the HJ at this stack depth they are weak passive.


2 flop bet sizing-if we know a V has all the Qx Jx KT hands in there range we know to use a bet sizing on the flop that gets them to fold Ax (x=2-8) as the Ax x=9 T J Q never folds here but the size does not over commit us to the pot as this V was not folding any made pairs or gutter draws on the flop.
We want to keep the SPR high so we can bluff turns. Our natural assumption is we can get some Jx to fold on turn no Qx is going to- some of the gutters give up.
Also would we bet pot with QQ AA KK if not we need to bet the amount we would bet with those hands in this spot which might be 50% pot or less most often.
Or we exploit bet even less in this spot by betting 33% or even 25% pot as some of the weakest Ax might fold to that. We do not want 77-22 to fold to a pot size flop bet when V is OOP.

We of course need to know how our player pool views small bets as they might attack a bet as small as 25%.

As to the river:

This weak passive V has all kinds of Kx combos by the river this V also has J8 Q8 TT maybe T8. Some % of the time the also show us AK waiting for us to bet our K or bluff river.
If by the river you can exclude an 8 or a K from a player this weak passive- I do not know how you did it.

So a FGS check back rather than thin value bet here is the correct choice because there is 0 player tendency data included in your example and a player at their skill level- if we bet small could suicide shove as a bluff on this river and we do not want to big bet or shove river for the above reasons

Hope this helps

Originally Posted by liuouhgkres

Preflop: Good isolate. In tournaments in general you want to raise smaller, because of shallower stacks. But here effective stacks are 80bbs, so you can raise 3.5x-4x.

Flop: This board is very good for you. You have QQ-JJ, overpairs, two pairs and good top pairs in your range. For this reason I think you should just range bet small, like 33%. However, if you want to split your range and use a bigger sizing you should check back 99. Villain is not folding better hands and not calling with worse. Very bad sizing with your hand. And remember, in 3bet pots you don't need to use big sizes, especially in position, because you can get all the money in anyway.

Turn: As played, you hit your set and have this very draw heavy board. Villain have a lot of flush draws, pair+gutshots and top pairs, so you should charge bigger. Your quarter pot bet is very bad, you are giving very great price to his draws. Would go 66%.

River: This spot is super villain dependant. Some villains never donk and have all straights in their range, while others always donk straights here. Also, when you bet some villains never raise bluff, while others might bluff check-raise here. If villain is passive I would bet small and fold to raise, and I think this is what you should do by default. If villain is very aggressive, then you can check back.

Overall, very poorly played, because you made mistakes on every street.

Yep. Thank you for your candid analysis. I have taken away quite a bit from posting this hand. Onward adn upward!