$Freeroll NLHE MTT: Facing a 3bet in position with 20 bb

[Naty2585]

i open 2x AdTd on the button and face a 7bb 3bet from the SB(he was the CL and he was 3beting and calling shoves very louse) and we were at the ITM bubble, i call and the flop came Kxx rainbow, he X and i X back,turn is a brick and he bets 3/4 off pot and i fol.
Should i had risket in the bubble and 4bet jam with the ATs/ Should i had 3bet him on the turn trying to bluff him out an A high beater tham mine/

 

[dino]

since you playing freerolls, why not.
If you're in the money game, then I would recommend to play more carefully to get your money back, but I use to play more aggresive when arround bubble just because many people try to get ITM and min cash.
That's the reason I am trying to steal more blinds and pus them out.

 

[fundiver199]

I dont want to put in 35% of my chips preflop and then fold later, so for me this is a jam or fold spot. And if he is as loose, as you say, then I probably just jam and hope for the best. Maybe there is even a chance, he fold, if he is completely out of line with his 3-bets.

 

[moulan7]

Yes I agree with fundiver, call is the worst option with your stack size. Either shove or fold.
Also jamming instead of raising is not a bad action too in the first place.
As played you can't do much. 3bet on the turn makes no sense at all if you want him to fold, since he bet 3/4 of the pot he can't fold for 2-3bb more (since you called the 7bb raise pot has 14-15bb and you have left with 13bb. if he bets 3/4 this is more than 10bb. you have not fold equity here)

 

[Nr98]

I dont want to put in 35% of my chips preflop and then fold later, so for me this is a jam or fold spot. And if he is as loose, as you say, then I probably just jam and hope for the best. Maybe there is even a chance, he fold, if he is completely out of line with his 3-bets.

Bit annoying that it is the exact bubble and we got 0 fold equity (unless he's a fish). But either way ATs on the button for 20bb is a hand we simply have to jam. It's way too strong.

Edit: 3Bet jam that is, just to clarify.

 

[fundiver199]

Bit annoying that it is the exact bubble and we got 0 fold equity (unless he's a fish). But either way ATs on the button for 20bb is a hand we simply have to jam. It's way too strong. Edit: 3Bet jam that is, just to clarify.

If the Villain was a tight player, or this was a tournament, where a min-cash really mattered to us, I dont see anything terrible wrong with min-raising and then folding to a 3-bet. We would still have 18BB left, which does not change a whole lot. But in a freeroll, where a min-cash might be 10c and against someone, we already noticed as being out of line, there is no way on earth, I am not getting AT in for 20BB in a late position battle.

 

[Nr98]

If the Villain was a tight player, or this was a tournament, where a min-cash really mattered to us, I dont see anything terrible wrong with min-raising and then folding to a 3-bet. We would still have 18BB left, which does not change a whole lot. But in a freeroll, where a min-cash might be 10c and against someone, we already noticed as being out of line, there is no way on earth, I am not getting AT in for 20BB in a late position battle.

You know any suited ace, suited broadway, pocket pair and some offsuit aces should be a 3bet jam (or open jam) in this spot? It's not that losing 2bb changes too much ofcourse, but just that a 3bet jam is waaaaay too +EV to pass up on. Yes maybe ICM makes us a bit tighter, but not to the point where we want to ever be folding ATs. Villain would have to be an absolute nit over a huge sample size to ever consider that (like a 3% 3bet stat or something).

 

[Jon Poker]

I dont want to put in 35% of my chips preflop and then fold later, so for me this is a jam or fold spot. And if he is as loose, as you say, then I probably just jam and hope for the best. Maybe there is even a chance, he fold, if he is completely out of line with his 3-bets.

This is completely a jam or fold spot. Even with a spazzy opponent and a wide range here - if we are on the stone money bubble we cant risk busting. Some ROI is better than none, so that being said we have to fold. If there's 15+ people left before we make the $$ I would probably just jam vs an opponent who is loose and generally out of line. I dont care if he 3bets and calls me off with J9 and gets there...as long as I get my money in good I try to stay focused on my plays rather than being results oriented. Sure it sucks when we make the right move and still lose, but if we keep making those moves over and over and over we will see long term results from what is a long term game.

Conclusion- jam or fold :: if we are 5 people or less away from the money, then snap fold - if we are mid game or quite a few people to go before the money, snap jam vs LAG opponent.

 

[300HPGOD]

With a 20 BB stack you should not be thinking of calling 3 bets. They should be fold or shove 4 bets. In my opinion in this situation it comes down to how much do we want to cash vs win and what do we really think of our opponent. Is he capable of doing this with A9, A8 or broadway hands? If the answer is yes we can surely jam with the fold equity plus the equity of our cards. If we are unsure if opponent would jam those then it is an ICM decision. My personal choice would be to just fold but that is me. Jamming is not bad here usually, but calling is bad.

 

[fundiver199]

Against a normal opponent in a normal tournament I would fold here. Even in late position we are typically not in good shape, if we call a 20BB rejam with ATo, and this is essentially the same thing. Its the freeroll factor and the description of the Villain, which makes me want to get it in here. If he will stack off any ace as well as a lot of broadways and suited connector type hands, then we are doing totally fine with ATo.

Also in freerolls I typically dont care about a min-cash. I want to go for the final table at minimum. It depends which freeroll it is though. If a min-cash is like 2-3$, then I might want to lock that up first. But if its less than 1$, it really does not matter to me. I did not pay anything to enter, so its not even like, I will come out with a loss, if I bubble.

 

[Nr98]

This is completely a jam or fold spot. Even with a spazzy opponent and a wide range here - if we are on the stone money bubble we cant risk busting. Some ROI is better than none, so that being said we have to fold. If there's 15+ people left before we make the $$ I would probably just jam vs an opponent who is loose and generally out of line. I dont care if he 3bets and calls me off with J9 and gets there...as long as I get my money in good I try to stay focused on my plays rather than being results oriented. Sure it sucks when we make the right move and still lose, but if we keep making those moves over and over and over we will see long term results from what is a long term game.

Conclusion- jam or fold :: if we are 5 people or less away from the money, then snap fold - if we are mid game or quite a few people to go before the money, snap jam vs LAG opponent.

Yeah agree that we should take ICM into consideration, but there's no way that makes us want to fold a hand as strong as ATs BU vs SB for 20bb. Ez jam imo, unless he's a total nit who never 3bets.

Would be interesting though if anyone could put a similar spot into an ICM calculator. Curious to see the results.

 

[Poker Orifice]

or.. vs. this type of player >>>
Limp RRAI

 

[demesquita]

Shove preflop for sure!!
he is lose agressive and you have a very decent chance on being ahead of him. Shove and hope for the best. You don't want to arrive ITM with chips justfo be drained in a while, you want to arrive big and have a true chance to arrive among the top places with bigger earnings.