Calling a flop push? ITM 3.40 turbo NLHE

NineLions

NineLions

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My first ITM playing these 3.40 turbos. I really need work on my STT as I'm not even breaking even at any level recently.

I got ITM with 2 BBs to my stack as Pat took out the 4 place player. After getting ITM I pushed with 57o, hit a trey of 5s and worked my way back. We've since whittled down Pat's $11,000 stack, and 4 or 5 hands back the three of us were dead even.

I think if he's LAG, I call this anyways. If he's tight, do I call this just because of pot odds?


pokerstars Game #11211339537: Tournament #56874352, $3.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level IX (300/600) - 2007/07/30 - 00:55:50 (ET)
Table '56874352 1' 10-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: bactcs (4840 in chips)
Seat 6: Ninelions (6320 in chips)
Seat 7: Pat_Mclean (3840 in chips)
bactcs: posts the ante 50
Ninelions: posts the ante 50
Pat_Mclean: posts the ante 50
bactcs: posts small blind 300
Ninelions: posts big blind 600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Ninelions [Ks Qh]
Pat_Mclean: raises 600 to 1200
bactcs: folds
Ninelions: calls 600
*** FLOP *** [Th 9h 5s]
Ninelions: checks
Pat_Mclean: bets 2590 and is all-in
 
rob5775

rob5775

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If your two overs were good with the gutshot draw that's what? 10 outs right? You have to call 2600 into 4400 (I'm at work so I am using my fingers and toes right now.). Thats almost the correct odds if all your outs were clean.

That being said, you can't call his bet here. You have K hi with a gutshot. Just fold to his A hi or JT and continue grinding away on him. It seems to have worked so far.
 
Stick66

Stick66

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Standard fold. Not only is your draw a sketchy one, but you also want to stay about even in chips. With a bigger lead, I might call this. But I think stack sizes play a big part here.

I love playing those $3 Stars turbos. Great BR builder and cheap STT practice.
 
dj11

dj11

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I call this.

But then I'm a flopologist.
 
J

julyangels

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I would have to fold, but, sounds like he might have been reeling and spinning from being picked apart, so I would almost bet on him hanging himself, and wait for the next and better oppurtunity.
 
NineLions

NineLions

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So folding this to a TAG, and a LAG as well?
 
J

joeeagles

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This is a fold NL. Although you might be ahead, in your situation its best to keep the chip lead or stay with even stacks, as it appears to be with a fold, rather than calling an all-in with K high.

I wouldn't put any relevance in this specific case to whatever read you may have on villain, whether he's TAG or LAG it doesn't really matter. The 2590 bet represents half your remaining stack, its a suicide to call this with so many ways to lose the pot. Its much better to open shove PF with ATC next hand rather than throwing in your chips in this spot.

I understand the temptation because he probably missed this flop also, why else shove? But you may still be behind to an A or small pair and not catch him. There is the chance he's shoving on a flush draw, a lot of crazy players and crazy moves on these tournies.

Fold.
 
Dorkus Malorkus

Dorkus Malorkus

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I think the flop is a pretty standard fold. Pulling a stop n' go and shoving first on the flop is infinitely preferable to check-calling, but I don't dislike just check-folding either.

Preflop is much more interesting imo - does anyone else like shoving preflop here or is our fold equity too limited?
 
J

joeeagles

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Preflop is much more interesting imo - does anyone else like shoving preflop here or is our fold equity too limited?


I don't think its a terrible idea with KQ, considering its 3 handed even if he calls you still likely have 2 live cards. Villain has 2590 after his raise, so I believe you're right on the border of having FE.

Right or wrong it may be, I support shoving PF much more than calling the all-in on that flop with K high.
 
NineLions

NineLions

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I appreciate the responses as they help me to work with what was an interesting hand for me.


I called this flop shove, but the primary reason for doing so was some information that I didn't give, and I didn't because I was hoping for perspectives/opinions on the situation without the info. In the process I've learned more than I expected. If I detach myself from the hand as much as I can, I think that I would have folded this as well based on the info I gave.


I called his shove because 1) I had him covered, 2) I believed my 10 outs were good, 3) I had K high, but mostly because I had seen him pushing flops throughout the tournament. He seemed to be a decent enough player that he wasn't doing this with monster hands (ie. I've flopped the nuts, time to push!). Putting the pressure on by pushing the flop was his move. He had shown a willingness to do this with nothing early on in the tourney when he pushed his friend off a hand (they were chatting in French, and the other guy stayed around after being eliminated) and then showed his cards. In the hand here he had J3s.


The consensus for folding shows me how powerful the stop-and-go play is, and I think he played it very well. Get 1/4-1/3 of your chips in preflop against someone who has the same or not too many more chips, then push the flop, especially after I checked.
 
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