BB special late in $4/180

ChuckTs

ChuckTs

Legend
Joined
Feb 2, 2005
Total posts
13,642
Villain is 40/.5/3 but only through a dozen hands or so. So far lots of limps and some postflop bets from him. Very last hand he limped and bet when checked to, and he took the pot down.

I've played a tag game since sitting down, showing down AJs vs a shortstack, and taking down another pot without showing.

Our move?

Pokerstars Game (?) Tournament #65550947, $4.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2007/10/29 - 13:24:27 (ET)
Table '65550947 3' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: adamr100 (8442 in chips)
Seat 4: Hero (11501 in chips)
Seat 5: FRENCHIE0212 (4420 in chips)
Seat 6: PeanutFlush (4524 in chips)
Seat 7: paco_sc (2520 in chips)
Seat 8: cueist147 (10625 in chips)
Seat 9: 7_ofone (9981 in chips)
adamr100: posts the ante 25
Hero : posts the ante 25
FRENCHIE0212: posts the ante 25
PeanutFlush: posts the ante 25
paco_sc: posts the ante 25
cueist147: posts the ante 25

7_ofone: posts the ante 25
adamr100: posts small blind 200
Hero : posts big blind 400

Holecards:
Dealt to Hero [
diam8.gif
heartJ.gif
]
>>>paco_sc said, "position POSITION"
FRENCHIE0212: folds
PeanutFlush: folds
paco_sc: folds
cueist147: calls 400
7_ofone: folds
adamr100: folds
Hero : checks

Flop:
[
heart3.gif
clubJ.gif
club8.gif
]
Hero : ...
 
P

phatjose

Rock Star
Joined
Oct 2, 2007
Total posts
222
I think we need to lead out and bet the pot here to drive off the drawing hands. It sucks to not be able to really get more value from top 2 pair, but given the fact that the villain will limp often, it's really hard to say for certain he doesn't have a straight or flush draw.

What it looks like, based on his numbers and stack size, is that this guy wants to play a pretty wide range of hands, for really cheap, and then get his value post flop. So I think what we can assume is that if he hit the flop, he's gonna call, and if he missed or is on a draw, he's going to fold. The real tricky part is that if we bet, and he comes over the top, then what? He could have almost any hand in that situation.
 
dj11

dj11

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Total posts
23,189
Awards
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I think you are asking whether or not to slow play this hand.

In this particular case I think NOT. Had it been rainbow, you would have had at least one more card to go and could slow play, but the flush draw sort of clinched it for me, you have to seek value, but in this case your value could end abruptly with another club, or any 9,T,Q or 7. The str8 to me is of a little less worry, but then you did describe the guy as active (my description of your description), giving him a very large range.

I would consider his min bet as a cheap cbet. 1/2 pot, see if he is chasing, maybe a bit more than half pot is my first impression. But then considering the stack sizes I think a pot sized bet will take this down now, and is probably the better move. You could survive villain going nuts here with a draw, and that will likely only happen if you slow play this.

Juggling all this mentally tells me that sometimes I will bet this big, and sometimes slow play it, and that is because I want to at least create the illusion that I am unpredictable, if I only create that illusion to myself. ;)
 
Falloooooon

Falloooooon

Rock Star
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Total posts
155
I think that if I had a few more hands of watching this guy bet at everything after the flop it would be an easy slowplay. As is, with a dozen hands, I would lead out and find out just how agro he really is and pray to be raised.
 
tosborn

tosborn

Visionary
Joined
Feb 26, 2007
Total posts
579
I would raise this sometimes and other times check/raise. I don't mind letting villain peel one off either. I don't even mind playing this passively on the flop and flat calling a villain bet. I really can't see many trouble cards. Pretty much do anything but fold.

If villain is holding AJ, KJ, or even QJ, they probably bet preflop. No flush draw and the straight draw is always going to be there. We need to be cautious of the small set because of the limp.

I don't think there is much that you can do wrong on this street. I probably lean more towards betting out because that fits your line better (made or missed hand).

If you bet make it 400-600. We definately don't want to overbet here.
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

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Well I decided to go for a check-raise. No real great reason other than the fact that I knew he'd bet. Not only that, but a draw is possible, and people generally don't give check-raises the respect they deserve, so I could get paid off big here.

Pokerstars Game (?) Tournament #65550947, $4.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2007/10/29 - 13:24:27 (ET)
Table '65550947 3' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: adamr100 (8442 in chips)
Seat 4: Hero (11501 in chips)
Seat 5: FRENCHIE0212 (4420 in chips)
Seat 6: PeanutFlush (4524 in chips)
Seat 7: paco_sc (2520 in chips)
Seat 8: cueist147 (10625 in chips)
Seat 9: 7_ofone (9981 in chips)
adamr100: posts the ante 25
Hero : posts the ante 25
FRENCHIE0212: posts the ante 25
PeanutFlush: posts the ante 25
paco_sc: posts the ante 25
cueist147: posts the ante 25
7_ofone: posts the ante 25
adamr100: posts small blind 200
Hero : posts big blind 400

Holecards:
Dealt to Hero [
diam8.gif
heartJ.gif
]
>>>paco_sc said, "position POSITION"
FRENCHIE0212: folds
PeanutFlush: folds
paco_sc: folds
cueist147: calls 400
7_ofone: folds
adamr100: folds
Hero : checks

Flop:
[
heart3.gif
clubJ.gif
club8.gif
]
Hero : checks
cueist147: bets 1200
Hero : raises 2000 to 3200
cueist147: calls 2000

Turn:
[
heart3.gif
clubJ.gif
club8.gif
] [
diam4.gif
]
Hero
: ...

Now what?

Pot is ~7600, and villain has 7000 left in his stack. I have him covered.
 
tosborn

tosborn

Visionary
Joined
Feb 26, 2007
Total posts
579
Bet 3000. We want to get his money in by the river. Price him in now. I'm not scarred of much other than the sets, and I'm going busto if he has one.
 
Effexor

Effexor

Cardschat Elite
Joined
May 13, 2006
Total posts
1,773
I'm putting him all in here. If he's on a draw you won't get any more chips if he misses on the river, and if you are beat already so be it.
 
Falloooooon

Falloooooon

Rock Star
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Total posts
155
I would also just go all in here. This type of player is more likely than most to just call with whatever his holding is. I think you get more money out of this situation in the long run by getting it all in now.
 
Chiefer

Chiefer

Legend
Joined
Jan 2, 2007
Total posts
4,886
i'm putting him on an overpair or flush draw. queens possibly and he's playing them for value. forth street is a blank. i would play my hand for value as well. lead out another 2 to 3 grand and not push simply because i don't want to risk my tourney life before the river comes out.
 
Dorkus Malorkus

Dorkus Malorkus

HELLO INTERNET
Joined
Jul 12, 2005
Total posts
12,422
Arrrrrrrrrrrinnnnn.

- We're reasonably sure we have the best hand and are getting our money in good. On a substantial proportion of rivers we won't have the luxury of being so certain of this.

- Villain isn't folding many hands in his range here (and we're ahead of his range).

- Villain certainly isn't folding many, if any more hands for say 3k on the turn than he is folding for his stack.
 
J

jeffred1111

Visionary
Joined
Apr 16, 2007
Total posts
792
Easy shove and I'd even like a bigger c/r on the flop tyo create a bigger pot and make him commit himself. This is not a hand where we want to play small ball even if it wasn't raised preflop. Villain has AJ, KJ, QJ, J3, overpairs, etc. but the turn is probably the best card that could've popped for you. A shove here will probably seen as weakness and a call is almost assured (while we are ahead probably 95% of the time here).

The c/r call has probably ruled out the drawing hands from his range and if not, well, you know he's a live one.
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

Legend
Joined
Feb 2, 2005
Total posts
13,642
I bet 3500, he folded.

Don't ask me what my reasoning was; mostly trying to suck him in. I think pushing is fine. Leading and ch-r AI on turn lead flop lead turn is fine too.
 
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