Analysis of NineLions' $69+6 STT

[ChuckTs]

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Punched some hands into SnGWiz for a little more analysis, but tbh I'm a little rusty with my STT strategy. Hope it helped and sorry it took so long.

Video is 51mb large, 41 mins long.

 

[bw07507]

wow very nice, wasnt aware NL was playing at this level, will definately be looking at this later.

 

[NineLions]

Very cool; thanks for all the prep work on top of all the actual recording/analysis.

I will have to pick up an ICM program if I decide to get more serious about SnGs. Right now I play cheap turbos basically when I have 1/2 to kill which is why I chose to play a turbo in this situation. Just out of general current familiarity with the timing/structure.


bw, the reason I was playing this high of a buy in was that I got a $75 token from placing in the top 6 of a 300 Tilt points freeroll. My Tilt bankroll at the time was $71, so less than the buyin, but they wouldn't let me turn it into T$ so I had to pick something. I was happy to be able to turn Full Tilt points into $124. Either I was lucky in terms of opponents, or the difference in play quality really isn't that far removed from the $2 ones.


I knew I was going to tend to towards tight/weak just because of the buy in level, but the hands that I remember being aware of that weren't mostly the ones that you and the SnG Wizard picked so that's definitely helpful. I do remember letting myself get chipped down towards the end because I couldn't figure out where to steal;, the tight guy to my left who was showing his willingness to shove over me, the loose big stack, or the TAG way over to my right. After the loose guy called down shoves with T8s and 98o I was leary about trying to steal from him when we were both big stacks.


Thanks again, Chuck.

 

[ChuckTs]

np and congrats on the cash

 

[NineLions]

btw, I'd recommend this vid, not for my play, but for Chuck's analysis, and even more to see how some of the players at this level play, which is not all good. Mind you, some of them might have gotten there the same way I did.

 

[bw07507]

Just watched this and was very impressed with ChuckTs analysis. He says a few times that hes no expert throughout the video, but this is very, very good analysis for anyone that is trying to improve their S&G game.

 

[switch0723]

Chucks sitngo analysis > the fact i have less than 20 hours to finish coursework

56% downloaded

 

[switch0723]

nice analysis chuck and nice cash nl

1 Question

At 31:33 in the video we have 8,6 suited i think in the bb with 200/400 blinds.

The UTG shortstack open pushes for about 1.4k. Now he has just lost a pot, its the hand after the 9's vs kings for NL's double up, so we can widen his range. You just say 'we can't call this' and moved on, but i looked in depth at this hand and found out the following

When the action is folded to us, it is about 1k to call into a pot that is about 2k. So effectivly 2:1 odds. Our hand is about a 3:2 underdog to overcards. So we are technically getting great odds to call against two overcards. But another key factor is the fact we are 2nd in chips. If we do call this shove, and we lose, we will still be 2nd in chips and will still have over 1k of an advantage over 3rd, therefore will still be in a great position to finish 2nd, nevermind cashing for 3rd. If we win, we can burst the bubble and set our sights on 1st with the big stack.

Therefore based on the odds presented and the percentages of our hand against villains wide range, the size of our stack, the position we will be in if the worst case scenario occurs, i think we call this shove with 8,6 suited

 

[NineLions]

Hmmm, interesting thought Switch.

Maybe Chuck can plug it into SnG Wiz and see what it says about this one too.

For me it was an autofold, but I'm learning that I'm probably playing too tight with calls in particular. Some of the raises/shoves I coulda/shoulda done were due to the buyin level and a stronger desire to cash than to win, but most of the call/folds of raises/shoves were standard plays for me, except for the AJ in the SB.

 

[ChuckTs]

Nice eye switch, I remember thinking that it was a little more expensive for us there. SnGWiz says it's a call if he's pushing wider than %17 of his hands which of course he should be here.

One thing that ICM calculators don't factor in is the edge you gain by actually keeping a short stack in on the bubble. I recently saw a post where someone folded a shortstack's push getting literally like 50:1 (he had barely over a BB in his stack) because he knew that the edge he would maintain by keeping someone in would allow him to build on his stack even further since everyone was playing so cautiously on the bubble.

We have a big loose stack two to our left here, but since the early stages he's tightened up considerably. The other two guys are very tight and I think we could have exploited it a lot more than NL did. Anyways just a point to consider, but there's nothing wrong with calling there. Again I'm very rusty with my STT strategy and everything I say could be completely wrong

 

[switch0723]

Maybe Chuck can plug it into SnG Wiz and see what it says about this one too.

^^ Definately, CHUCK!!!!!

were due to the buyin level and a stronger desire to cash than to win

^^ Very understandable, and it was clear in your play, but its the same as what i would do if i played at a higher level than i usually do so i can see why you were playing with scared money. You still played well though but you definately need to steal more,

you only really raised 4 times or something like that in the entire tourny pre flop. And 2 of those were with kings and once with aces. You can go entire stt's without getting a big pair, so if that had occured, you would have been limited to one pfr for the entire tourny, which is never going to win you any cash

 

[switch0723]

One thing that ICM calculators don't factor in is the edge you gain by actually keeping a short stack in on the bubble. I recently saw a post where someone folded a shortstack's push getting literally like 50:1 (he had barely over a BB in his stack) because he knew that the edge he would maintain by keeping someone in would allow him to build on his stack even further since everyone was playing so cautiously on the bubble.

^^^ As much as that is very true in mtt's, in the stt's, i don't think it is as profitable, unless you have a huge stack agaisnt 3 small stacks. Since in general, you are never far enough ahead of the short stacks in a stt, to allow them to stay in. Also, the tactic is more profitable in mtt's where a huge proportion of the prize goes to top players, so you need a huge stack. In a stt, you dont need a huge stack to take first, i think its more profitable to think about knocking out other players, than building for heads up effectivly.

Edit: Also i should add, im no sit n go pro either, i mean just check my sharkscope, i rarely play them, and when i do play them, i just lose, so take my advice with a pinch of salt. I know how to play them though, and if i tried, i would probably be very successful, i just find them too boring playing all that time for a small profits

 

[switch0723]

Also chuck, any chance of you linking me to a place to get SnGWiz? I think i might actually try playing stt's for a while now i have free time. Cheers

 

[ChuckTs]

The SitNGo Wizard - Home

$99 although it has a 30 day free trial. Again there are other, free, ICM calculators out there that are simply less schnazzy. Just google "ICM calculator".

 

[switch0723]

alright cheers chuck, ill have a look around for about 10 minutes until i get bored of looking around for 1, then ill come back to SitNGo Wiz. $99 seems a fair investment.

Can it be used for certain mtt or larger sit n go tournys aswell?