AKo in bb lateish stages of an mtt

S

Shandy

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Just wondering if any of you would make this call, approx 900 entrants 135 pay, about 130 left, so just in the money, $8 rebuy- have rebought quite a few times, the bottom paylevel is approx $40, which probably only just covers what i spent if it does. Seen villian get all his chips in pf with AKo earlier after raise reraise. Not really worried about utg raiser as only need to beat balint to make a profit from hand.
pokerstars Game #10900703421: Tournament #54945795, $8.00+$0.80 Hold'em No Limit - Level XIII (800/1600) - 2007/07/12 - 13:27:08 (ET)
Table '54945795 8' 9-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 2: siberium (69936 in chips)
Seat 3: balint6 (82715 in chips)
Seat 4: Warhawk74 (25798 in chips)
Seat 5: poca7 (21305 in chips)
Seat 6: Smily2001 (38420 in chips)
Seat 7: Lizzyg19 (20779 in chips)
Seat 8: 222shay222 (45585 in chips)
Seat 9: LICO01 (14685 in chips)
siberium: posts the ante 150
balint6: posts the ante 150
Warhawk74: posts the ante 150
poca7: posts the ante 150
Smily2001: posts the ante 150
Lizzyg19: posts the ante 150
222shay222: posts the ante 150
LICO01: posts the ante 150
Lizzyg19: posts small blind 800
222shay222: posts big blind 1600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to 222shay222 [Ac Ks]
revirjohn is connected
LICO01: raises 3200 to 4800
siberium: folds
balint6: raises 77765 to 82565 and is all-in
Warhawk74: folds
poca7: folds
Smily2001: folds
Lizzyg19: folds
222shay222:?????????
 
Jack Daniels

Jack Daniels

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222shay222:?????????
Folds. At least IMO. I don't like calling all-in here against the big stack with AKo. Had you been next to act facing that initial raise, I'd say push. But now's not a time to be gambling with A high.

Just because he's been laggy, doesn't mean that he doesn't have a hand here. Even a simple pair of 22 is beating you atm. Granted his over-raise is a bit suspect, I still don't like gambling here.
 
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ChuckTs

ChuckTs

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This looks a lot like an isolation raise to me. Initial raiser isn't even 10BBs deep, and I wouldn't be surprised if we're miles ahead of pusher's range.

Any PT stats or actual reads aside from seeing him push AK?
 
I

IVEverLow

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This looks a lot like an isolation raise to me. Initial raiser isn't even 10BBs deep, and I wouldn't be surprised if we're miles ahead of pusher's range.

Agreed.
 
blankoblanco

blankoblanco

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Initial raiser's range is big what with a short stack and all. The huge isolation raise is like never (<2%) AA or KK. You're dominating balint's AQ/AJ often. Coinflipping a lot too, but I think the advantage of knowing you're virtually never dominated by balint but frequently have him dominated, is substantial. I'm playing for 1st and probably call
 
Effexor

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The more I think about it, I'd call. I don't understand why UTG just raised when he's basically in a push fold situation, so possibly a weak blind steal attempt. The big stack's range could go as weak as A9o, but I'd think it's more in the lines of AJ / AQ. Sure looks like he's trying to isolate and steal maybe by putting the small stack all in. I mean if he does isolate, he's only risking less than another 10k.

Edit. combuboom's response wasn't up as I was typing mine in, funny we came up with the similar hand range.
 
Jack Daniels

Jack Daniels

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Part of the issue I have here is that the initial raiser is essentially pot committing himself with that raise and an M of 4. Why didn't he just push to hopefully pick up the blinds and antes and up his stack 25%? To me it looks like he wants action and raised into mr laggy figuring he'll come over the top and still get all his money in PF. A push is more likely to scare everyone off and just get the blinds whereas a hand that wants action wants to seem less intimidating. I can appreciate calling here, but I think it's close at best as I see it.
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

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Even if the initial raiser has a big pair (I agree with your reasoning - it's either a cheap steal attempt or a very luring bet with a big hand), if we call and win, we'll still rake in a huge pot because the raiser #1's stack is so small.
 
heatfan03

heatfan03

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i fold. Your doing fine on chips in a tourney. no reason to risk it all on a coin flip when you dont need to. You can find a better spot. Like when you have seen the flop and know 5 of your 7 cards. But thing is your probably facing a coin flip when you dont need to with all your chips.

bottom line: fold and wait for a better opportunity.
 
Jack Daniels

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Even if the initial raiser has a big pair (I agree with your reasoning - it's either a cheap steal attempt or a very luring bet with a big hand), if we call and win, we'll still rake in a huge pot because the raiser #1's stack is so small.
You've got a good point, I don't disagree. Guess I'm just a bit of a nit with AKo when I have to call an all in from the big stack who reraised a pot committed initial raiser. That's probably why I'm seeing it as a close decision. The more I read other responses, the more I think I'm 50/50 to call/fold and it would probably be decided by what I've actually observed from these players if I was at the table.
 
S

Shandy

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Yeah my thinking was also that it looked like an isolation raise, and was probably up against a low pair or a worse Ace, also my thinking was that if i called and won i could take a good run at the ft, if i call and miss well ive still broke even. As it turned out i did get 4th in the tourney, which i doubt i would have done without this hand, was pretty shocked to see his holding, and amazed at the original raiser- crazy
PokerStars Game #10900703421: Tournament #54945795, $8.00+$0.80 Hold'em No Limit - Level XIII (800/1600) - 2007/07/12 - 13:27:08 (ET)
Table '54945795 8' 9-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 2: siberium (69936 in chips)
Seat 3: balint6 (82715 in chips)
Seat 4: Warhawk74 (25798 in chips)
Seat 5: poca7 (21305 in chips)
Seat 6: Smily2001 (38420 in chips)
Seat 7: Lizzyg19 (20779 in chips)
Seat 8: 222shay222 (45585 in chips)
Seat 9: LICO01 (14685 in chips)
siberium: posts the ante 150
balint6: posts the ante 150
Warhawk74: posts the ante 150
poca7: posts the ante 150
Smily2001: posts the ante 150
Lizzyg19: posts the ante 150
222shay222: posts the ante 150
LICO01: posts the ante 150
Lizzyg19: posts small blind 800
222shay222: posts big blind 1600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to 222shay222 [Ac Ks]
revirjohn is connected
LICO01: raises 3200 to 4800
siberium: folds
balint6: raises 77765 to 82565 and is all-in
Warhawk74: folds
poca7: folds
Smily2001: folds
Lizzyg19: folds
222shay222: calls 43835 and is all-in
LICO01: folds
*** FLOP *** [7h 7s Ad]
*** TURN *** [7h 7s Ad] [9c]
*** RIVER *** [7h 7s Ad 9c] [Js]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
222shay222: shows [Ac Ks] (two pair, Aces and Sevens)
balint6: shows [Kd Kh] (two pair, Kings and Sevens)
222shay222 collected 97670 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 97670 | Rake 0
Board [7h 7s Ad 9c Js]
Seat 2: siberium folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: balint6 showed [Kd Kh] and lost with two pair, Kings and Sevens
Seat 4: Warhawk74 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: poca7 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: Smily2001 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: Lizzyg19 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 8: 222shay222 (big blind) showed [Ac Ks] and won (97670) with two pair, Aces and Sevens
Seat 9: LICO01 folded before Flop
 
blankoblanco

blankoblanco

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wow, I'm really surprised to see that too. I'm still leaning to calling in this situation even though he happened to have KK this time. Good thing I qualified my "never" statement with <2%. ;)
 
ChuckTs

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I'm right alongside combu here - I really would expect KK to raise a much more inviting amount here rather than just stick his stack in. I still call.
 
Jack Daniels

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Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee! ;)
 
mrsnake3695

mrsnake3695

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What the hell was the short stack doing?

He raised but not all-in with less than 10X BB and then folded to a raise, WTF?

That' what shockd me most about the hand.

I can actually understand the re-raise push her sinc he prob didn't want any lone aces in the hand.
 
blankoblanco

blankoblanco

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I can actually understand the re-raise push her sinc he prob didn't want any lone aces in the hand.

Yeah, I think this is why KK covers almost all of the very rare times this will be in the AA/KK group.. fear of an A.

But consider that your AK does as well vs KK as AQ does against your AK and I think he's faar more likely to have AQ than KK (on pure odds alone, but especially given the isolation over-raise). What would put you in real trouble is if he had AA, and I just can't imagine the guy would want to scare off action that much with AA, ever. KK at least makes a tiny bit of sense for irrational fear of an ace
 
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