99 Late in MTT

B

Bentheman87

Guest
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Total posts
794
Stacks:
* BTN with 5057
* SB with 7954
* BB with 24287
* UTG with 9701
* UTG+1 with 5896
* MP1 with 7030
* MP2 with 11285
* MP3 with 5710
* CO with 2320

hand.pl


hand.pl

Blinds:
Site: full tilt poker
* * Dealt to BTN:9♣ 9♠
* * Sklansky group 3
Preflop:
* * 5 players fold.
* * CO raises to 2,200
* * Hero raises to 5,032, and is all in
* * 1 players fold.
* * BB calls [4,732]
* * CO calls [95] [ all-in ]
* * Total folds this street: 6

Poker Hand Converter By Cardschat.com Poker Forum

Did I play this correct?
 
OzExorcist

OzExorcist

Broomcorn's uncle
Joined
Aug 6, 2007
Total posts
8,583
Awards
1
Reads / proximity to the bubble / blind level?
 
royalburrito24

royalburrito24

Legend
Joined
Aug 27, 2007
Total posts
2,417
Pointless without any reads/stats imo.
 
B

Bentheman87

Guest
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Total posts
794
Big blind was 300 SB was 150 antes were 25 my M was around 8. Very close to the bubble. I was changed tables at least 8 times in this tournament it was weird. I would get really close to going through the blinds, like I'd be 2nd position, then I'd get switched to a different table and start of on the button or CO. So just got on this table no reads. Some things to note though is the CO's M was about 3.5 so there's a good chance he has a weak hand, and also the BB has a huge stack.
 
B

Bentheman87

Guest
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Total posts
794
More reasoning plz. And what about just calling? If I just call and one of the blinds goes all in should I fold?
 
royalburrito24

royalburrito24

Legend
Joined
Aug 27, 2007
Total posts
2,417
More reasoning plz. And what about just calling? If I just call and one of the blinds goes all in should I fold?

Calling 40% of your stack and then folding to a re raise? No way!
It is hard to give you more reasoning when we have 0 reads. I just have to give you my opinion on the certain situation that you are in. You have an mzone of 8, very NTM, facing an all in with 99. If you want to make the money in this MTT, you cannot be pushing in such hard spots. I am folding this and waiting for a better situation to chip up. You are committing your entire stack on the bubble of a tournament with a questionable hand and more people to act behind you.
 
OzExorcist

OzExorcist

Broomcorn's uncle
Joined
Aug 6, 2007
Total posts
8,583
Awards
1
Flat calling with other players (including a big stack) yet to act really would be horrible, you're not getting anywhere near set mining odds but flopping a set would really be about the only thing that could make you comfortable.

So it's either shove or fold, but with an M of 8 this close to the bubble, I can find a fold here. Wait a bit longer to get the feel of the table.

With a hand like 99 you really don't want a call. Unless taking coinflips on the bubble excites you for some reason. But since the villain has effectively gone all-in (WTF is with that bet size?!? That alone makes me cautious and think that they're not playing conventionally, I'd want to know what that meant) we've got no fold equity and even if nobody else follows us in, we're still risking about half our stack on what's likely no better than a coinflip.
 
B

Bentheman87

Guest
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Total posts
794
McFugu shows [Kc Ac]
The_Dean221 shows [9h 7h]
*** FLOP *** [Ks Kd 2s]
*** TURN *** [Ks Kd 2s] [Jc]
*** RIVER *** [Ks Kd 2s Jc] [Jh]
Bentheman87 shows two pair, Kings and Jacks
McFugu shows a full house, Kings full of Jacks
McFugu wins the side pot (5,474) with a full house, Kings full of Jacks
The_Dean221 shows two pair, Kings and Jacks
McFugu wins the main pot (7,260) with a full house, Kings full of Jacks
McFugu: gg
YoungSupremacy: nh
The_Dean221 stands up
Bentheman87 stands up
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 12,734 Main pot 7,260. Side pot 5,474. | Rake 0
Board: [Ks Kd 2s Jc Jh]
Seat 1: Bentheman87 (button) showed [9c 9s] and lost with two pair, Kings and Jacks
Seat 2: YoungSupremacy (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 3: McFugu (big blind) showed [Kc Ac] and won (12,734) with a full house, Kings full of Jacks
Seat 4: RuinEm folded before the Flop
Seat 5: jimmykid79 folded before the Flop
Seat 6: G_grinda folded before the Flop
Seat 7: PAYING MY BILLS folded before the Flop
Seat 8: Michnak folded before the Flop
Seat 9: The_Dean221 showed [9h 7h] and lost with two pair, Kings and Jacks
 
K

khand

Rising Star
Joined
Feb 29, 2008
Total posts
15
Withregards to the O poster, a 99 is a must-allin hand w An M zone of 8, it is necessitated all-in mo
 
royalburrito24

royalburrito24

Legend
Joined
Aug 27, 2007
Total posts
2,417
Withregards to the O poster, a 99 is a must-allin hand w An M zone of 8, it is necessitated all-in mo

All this negated when playing the bubble imo.
 
B

Bentheman87

Guest
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Total posts
794
Well how strong of a hand do you think I need to shove here? Surely with JJ+ it's a shove. Same with AK. What about AQ? Remember its not like this is a satellite where 1-x places get entry and the rest get nothing. If I were on the bubble of a satellite tournament like that then I'd agree with folding 99 here but in this hand I'm still not sure...

"With a hand like 99 you really don't want a call. Unless taking coinflips on the bubble excites you for some reason. But since the villain has effectively gone all-in (WTF is with that bet size?!? That alone makes me cautious and think that they're not playing conventionally, I'd want to know what that meant) we've got no fold equity and even if nobody else follows us in, we're still risking about half our stack on what's likely no better than a coinflip."

If I knew I was only in a coinflip I'd fold here because we were close to the money, if I just broke the bubble then I wouldn't mind a coinflip since my M is almost in the red zone. But the CO had an M of only 3.5 so he could easily have ace 2 here or a pair smaller than 9s. Late position with an M of 3.5 and a first in vigorish it's usually correct to push with almost any hand. So when I pushed I was pretty confident I was well over 50% against the CO.
 
OzExorcist

OzExorcist

Broomcorn's uncle
Joined
Aug 6, 2007
Total posts
8,583
Awards
1
If I knew I was only in a coinflip I'd fold here because we were close to the money, if I just broke the bubble then I wouldn't mind a coinflip since my M is almost in the red zone. But the CO had an M of only 3.5 so he could easily have ace 2 here or a pair smaller than 9s. Late position with an M of 3.5 and a first in vigorish it's usually correct to push with almost any hand. So when I pushed I was pretty confident I was well over 50% against the CO.

Going from your other posts Ben, I think this is a mistake you've made more than once: you're assuming that your opponents are all playing rationally and applying the same logic you would.

As I pointed out, the cutoff didn't actually shove here - for some reason they left 95 behind. This alone, in the absence of any other reads, should be enough to make you suspect that this player isn't playing a rational game.

Non-rational opponent = approach with caution. You might have better than 50% equity here, or you might be crushed. Don't make the mistake of assuming that everyone knows how to play correctly.
 
ABorges

ABorges

Rock Star
Joined
Jul 3, 2007
Total posts
268
No matter what the outcome was, it was the correct move in my opinion. You're a favorite against small aces, lower pocket pairs and in a flip against overcards, few hands have you crushed, and even if they do, you still have him covered and can tighten up the next few hands to make the money in case you lose the hand. Your only worry should really be the blinds getting a bigger pair, in which case you're in trouble, but I don't think this happens enough times to justify laying 99 down in this spot.

One important question you should ask yourself is are you playing this tournament to finish in the money or to place big? If you want the latter (which you should, if you want to maximize your profit) you should shove here nearly without even thinking, you need to build a big stack to place at the top where the big money is; probably top 3 or so. Don't fold it to sneak in the money and get your measly buy-in back.
 
Top