$6.60 NLHE MTT Rebuy: $50k GTD Ac5c in the SB

[scubed]

Hand History driven straight to this forum with DriveHUD Poker Tracking Software

NL Holdem $2400.00(BB)
CO ($97361.00) [VPIP: 8.7% | PFR: 6.5% | AGG: 40% | 3-Bet: 0% | Hands: 46]
BTN ($33750.00) [VPIP: 13.9% | PFR: 10.5% | AGG: 20.3% | 3-Bet: 4.2% | Hands: 45208]
HERO ($55109.00)
BB ($86360.00) [VPIP: 8.5% | PFR: 4.2% | AGG: 10.9% | 3-Bet: 3% | hands: 215]
UTG ($175990.00)
EP ($39544.00)
MP1 ($119137.00)
MP2 ($100973.00) [VPIP: 51.2% | PFR: 14% | AGG: 11.6% | 3-Bet: 15.8% | Hands: 43]
HJ ($60740.00)

Dealt to Hero: A♣ 5♣

UTG Folds, EP Folds, MP1 Folds, MP2 Raises To $5100, HJ Folds, CO Calls $4800, BTN Calls $4800,

What should Hero do and why?

 

[fundiver199]

Either fold or jam. Against these specific opponents I prefer to fold. The original raiser is a fish and apparently does a lot of limping with these stats. This time however he mini-raised, which probably mean, he likes his hand. He also has us well covered, so I expect, that his mistake will be calling way to much against a jam, and this is not, what we want, when we are jamming A5s.

The two field callers are both nits, which is also bad, because they both have a really strong range. So even though they probably are conservative in stacking off, they will still have a lot of hands, that are to good to fold, and which we are in really bad shape against. We could also call of course, but I am not exited about playing 5-ways out of position with a hand like this and shallow stacks.

 

[xrhstos]

Not deep enough to be 3bet/squeezing as a bluff because Hero needs to commit their stack in order to do so.
A5s has reverse implied odds and we also have BB to act behind, so calling and acting OOP multiway on the SB seems like a recipe for disaster.
If Hero was on the BB just for the pot odds this hand is good enough for a call defend, but should be played very cautiously postflop.
In this instance Hero should just fold and find better spots to exploit in the future.

 

[jaworek1405]

Hello, If I have over 20 bb in stack I always call all aces suited OOP. That strategy should be good in micro level. So I call pre flop aces suited OOP and I hope that I caught some draws on the flop or one pair with backdoor flush draw. From the blinds I play passively aces suited, usually check/call flop and check/call turn. When I caught one pair with backdoor flush draw on the flop I always call one time bet for about 50%-67%, because when on the turn come up next suited card to our colour, then we can caught draws to flush and besides second pair, it will be draw for 14 outs. I think that tactic is profitable in long run and is worth to risk in micro tournament.

 

[Jon Poker]

This spot is not as complex as people make it. There is a case for jamming on this stack size as fundiver already eluded to - but I dont think this is specifically a jam or fold situation.

We have roughly 24bb or so in our stack and it will cost us roughly 1 more big blind to take a suited wheel ace to a flop multi way - I dont think we can fold here - pot odds are just to good and we have a hand that can make the nuts - we HAVE to see a flop here.

The great thing about our hand is it should be relatively easy to play post flop. We need to recognize that we dont want to flop top pair with the A, there's a likely chance we are dominated by a better ace somewhere and we definitely dont want to flop a pair of 5s in some weird fashion - both of those scenarios are nice good for us and should be check-folded to ANY bets taking place.

What we want when we call a hand like A5s is to flop 2 pair or better or the nut flush draw. When we do this, we look to check-jam and get it all in!

So in summary, our relative hand strength is not very strong - but has the potential to flop the nuts in one form or another - we are getting GREAT odds to call here even on a short stack - we see a flop and if we do not flop the nut flush draw, or 2 pair +, then we simply check fold - even top pair A because it's very likely our kicker is no good.

Simple sound strategy. We aren't going to win this hand alot, but when we do flop really well - we get paid! Not to mention mathematically this is an insanely profitable call.

 

[VovanBaron]

Hand History driven straight to this forum with DriveHUD Poker Tracking Software

NL Holdem $2400.00(BB)
CO ($97361.00) [VPIP: 8.7% | PFR: 6.5% | AGG: 40% | 3-Bet: 0% | Hands: 46]
BTN ($33750.00) [VPIP: 13.9% | PFR: 10.5% | AGG: 20.3% | 3-Bet: 4.2% | Hands: 45208]
HERO ($55109.00)
BB ($86360.00) [VPIP: 8.5% | PFR: 4.2% | AGG: 10.9% | 3-Bet: 3% | Hands: 215]
UTG ($175990.00)
EP ($39544.00)
MP1 ($119137.00)
MP2 ($100973.00) [VPIP: 51.2% | PFR: 14% | AGG: 11.6% | 3-Bet: 15.8% | Hands: 43]
HJ ($60740.00)

Dealt to Hero: A♣ 5♣

UTG Folds, EP Folds, MP1 Folds, MP2 Raises To $5100, HJ Folds, CO Calls $4800, BTN Calls $4800,

What should Hero do and why?

We have 23bb and in this stack size we can t play A5s overcalling, we r just too shallow to realize hand ev postflop ,so it is a bad idea...the other way is to squeeze but it is not a good decison here vs mp fishy villain cause we usually get call and it is a disaster to play oop vs 50/14 .So I think fold is the best ev preflop here.

I would reccomend to play A5s on SB overcalling 30bb and more.I would reccomend to squeeze on SB hands like A5s A6s A7s vs openraising mp/lp and cold callers mp/lp avoiding fishy players.

 

[scubed]

Thank you ALL for your thoughts. I really appreciate the thoughts and the time you took to write them.

...I am not excited about playing 5-ways out of position with a hand like this and shallow stacks.

Hero was thinking "there is no skill in hitting a flop - how can we possibly fight for the pot OOP against so many players."

Not deep enough to be 3bet/squeezing as a bluff because Hero needs to commit their stack in order to do so.

This is part of Hero's exact thoughts in the moment - didn't think a shove or raise would get folds, so thought Hero would be conserving chips by folding pre-flop.

So in summary, our relative hand strength is not very strong - but has the potential to flop the nuts in one form or another - we are getting GREAT odds to call here even on a short stack - we see a flop and if we do not flop the nut flush draw, or 2 pair +, then we simply check fold - even top pair A because it's very likely our kicker is no good.

I like your point about how easy it is for Hero to play this hand post-flop. For some reason, the thought process at the time did not include thinking about how easy it is to play mostly perfectly post flop.



If you are curious how it played out....

Spoiler

Hand History driven straight to this forum with DriveHUD Poker HUD and Database Software

NL Holdem $2400.00(BB)
CO ($97361.00) [VPIP: 8.7% | PFR: 6.5% | AGG: 40% | 3-Bet: 0% | Hands: 46]
BTN ($33750.00) [VPIP: 13.9% | PFR: 10.5% | AGG: 20.3% | 3-Bet: 4.2% | Hands: 45208]
HERO ($55109.00)
BB ($86360.00)
UTG ($175990.00)
EP ($39544.00)
MP1 ($119137.00)
MP2 ($100973.00) [VPIP: 51.2% | PFR: 14% | AGG: 11.6% | 3-Bet: 15.8% | Hands: 43]
HJ ($60740.00)

Dealt to Hero: A♣ 5♣

UTG Folds, EP Folds, MP1 Folds, MP2 Raises To $5100, HJ Folds, CO Calls $4800, BTN Calls $4800, HERO Folds, BB Folds

Flop ($20700.00): 9♣ K♠ 3♣
MP2 Checks, CO Checks, BTN Checks

Turn ($20700.00): 9♣ K♠ 3♣ 7♦
MP2 Checks, CO Bets $10350 (Rem. Stack: 81911.00), BTN Calls $10350 (Rem. Stack: 18300.00), MP2 Calls $10350 (Rem. Stack: 85523.00)

River ($51750.00): 9♣ K♠ 3♣ 7♦ 2♣
MP2 Checks, CO Checks, BTN Bets $18300 (allin), MP2 Calls $18300 (Rem. Stack: 67223.00), CO Folds

BTN shows: T♣ Q♣
MP2 shows: K♥ 2♥

BTN wins: $88350.00

 

[Jon Poker]

After the spoiler:

Folding is fine since we dont particularly didnt have a plan to navigate post flop - whenever we encounter spots where we are unsure of what to do it's best to fold and avoid the spot altogether.

That being said, if we would've called - flopping the nut flush draw - I would've checked with the intent to check-shove all in. Sure we dont hit our flush everytime, but it gives us the chance to win the pot on the flop and when we do get called we have enough equity to warrant the shove on the short stack.

That being said had we went to the flop it would have checked all the way through - when this happens with only one card to come I think we can no longer x/shove - in this instance I think we would have to call the 10k bet on the turn given our implied odds for when we hit our hand - if we dont we can still fold rivers leaving ourselves with close to 20bb and enough room to navigate comfortably looking for rejam spots.

Just as a side note the QTs I can see being involved in this hand but K2s is insane lol i would take a note on this guy for sure.

 

[fundiver199]

We have roughly 24bb or so in our stack and it will cost us roughly 1 more big blind to take a suited wheel ace to a flop multi way - I dont think we can fold here - pot odds are just to good and we have a hand that can make the nuts - we HAVE to see a flop here.

If we were in BB facing a mini-raise and a bunch of callers, then I agree. 1BB to call, 50% discount, lets see a flop. However in SB its 1,5BB to call, only 25% discount, and BB can still put in a squeeze. So in SB our odds are substantially worse.

This would not be the worst call in the world, but I feel, people tend to over value, how well suited aces play postflop. Yes sometimes they make the nut flush, and we can cooler someone. But we only flop a flush 1% of the time. The rest of the time we flop a draw, which we then need to see to completion. And its just so much better to flop a draw with position on one opponent rather than out of position against 3 or 4.

Finally there is the issue of A high boards, which just cannot be ignored. Especially if the flop gets checked through, its really difficult to maintain that conviction, that we only called preflop to hit two pair or better. We convince ourselfes, we might have the best hand, and we end up paying off one if not two bets.