$5 NL HE STT: Flopped set getting donked into on the river, when the flushdraw has completed

F

fundiver199

Legend
Loyaler
Joined
Jun 3, 2019
Total posts
13,712
Awards
1
Chips
352
Game
Hold'em
Game Format
No Limit
Table Format
STT
Buy-in
5
Game Options
  1. Turbo
Currency
$
Game is a 5$ 6-man SnG on Stars still in the first blind level. Opponent was playing VPIP 34 / PFR 22 with an AF of 1 over 119 hands. Call, fold or raise?

pokerstars, $4.56 + $0.44 - Hold'em No Limit - 10/20 (3 ante) - 5 players
Hand delivered by CardsChat - https://www.cardschat.com/hand-converter.php

UTG: 1,375 (69 bb)
CO: 2,919 (146 bb)
BU (Hero): 1,405 (70 bb)
SB: 1,593 (80 bb)
BB: 1,708 (85 bb)

Pre-Flop: (45) Hero is BTN with 5♦ 5♠
2 players fold, Hero raises to 60, 1 fold, BB calls 40

Flop: (145) 5♥ 2♥ K♣ (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets 58, BB calls 58

Turn: (261) 7♠ (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets 157, BB calls 157

River: (575) 9♥ (2 players)
BB bets 314, Hero?
 
V

VladB850

Visionary
Bronze Level
Joined
Jan 29, 2022
Total posts
557
Awards
1
Chips
81
I would call. If he has the color or set of 9s 314 is not a very big amount of chips to lose. And if he has only one or 2 pairs is a decent pot to win
 
R

raichek

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Feb 12, 2023
Total posts
15
Chips
34
I think the turn should have been overbet, after the seven came the board got too coordinated and of course he started stretching his straight flush draws...

And given his VPIP, you can call the river
 
Emily Trott

Emily Trott

Legend
Loyaler
Joined
Nov 11, 2020
Total posts
1,574
Awards
5
US
Chips
386
Big Blind stuck around for some reason. Could have been slow playing a set of kings, or maybe he hit his flush. Unless I had experience with, and notes of, how the opponent played, I'd probably fold.
 
F

feisas7991

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 2, 2014
Total posts
287
Awards
1
Chips
112
no brainer fold otr.
you also probably get to do big bets otf.
Hope this helps and Good Luck!
 
Matt_Burns88

Matt_Burns88

Legend
Loyaler
Joined
Aug 24, 2018
Total posts
1,504
Awards
2
GB
Chips
339
Obviously a horror card for you on the river. For me this comes down to your feel of whether villain has many (or any) bluffs in their range. The obvious ones are A3 and A4, all of which are certainly in his pre-flop calling range.

I would tend to rule out KK as they should be 3-betting pre, but 99 and 77 are definitely in their range and so are a lot of flushes.

Raising is out of the question as you're only getting called by better.

The thing that's making me scratch my head is it's kind of a strange size bet. It's neither a block bet, or a large polarising bet, so I'm a little at a loss as to how to respond, but I think at around 4:1 pot odds you need to call if you have ever seen villain bluff river with a half pot bet, but it could easily be a value bet desperate to get called.
 
F

fundiver199

Legend
Loyaler
Joined
Jun 3, 2019
Total posts
13,712
Awards
1
Chips
352
Thanks for the comments. I hated the river card and the action, because in my experience this line is so often a flush not wanting the opponent to check back hands, that were betting for value. But I felt, a set was just to high in my range to fold getting almost 3:1, so I sigh called, and here is the result:

 
Matt_Burns88

Matt_Burns88

Legend
Loyaler
Joined
Aug 24, 2018
Total posts
1,504
Awards
2
GB
Chips
339
Woah. Villain's play seems perfectly standard until the river. What is he doing there though? Going for value? bluffing with 2 pair? Blocking with 54% pot? Very strange. Having said that, I guess he saves himself 216 chips when he x/c's your pot sized river bet, but it doesn't seem right to me.
 
F

fundiver199

Legend
Loyaler
Joined
Jun 3, 2019
Total posts
13,712
Awards
1
Chips
352
Woah. Villain's play seems perfectly standard until the river. What is he doing there though? Going for value? Bluffing with 2 pair? Blocking with 54% pot? Very strange. Having said that, I guess he saves himself 216 chips when he x/c's your pot sized river bet, but it doesn't seem right to me.
I thought, he would be more polarized like a flush or nothing. But I dont think, his play is terrible. With two pair he beat most hands, that were betting the turn for value, and if he check, those hands will generally check back. But if he lead out, maybe he can get a crying call from hand like AA, AK, KQ, KJ. And then he can just fold, if he get raised. So I guess, it was a thin valuebet. But maybe to thin considering, that near half the people responding in this thread would actually have folded bottom set, and I also thought about it. If I just had one pair, I dont think, I would have called, or at least not without a flush blocker. Like maybe I call with AhKs but not with KsJc.
 
V

VladB850

Visionary
Bronze Level
Joined
Jan 29, 2022
Total posts
557
Awards
1
Chips
81
Thanks for the comments. I hated the river card and the action, because in my experience this line is so often a flush not wanting the opponent to check back hands, that were betting for value. But I felt, a set was just to high in my range to fold getting almost 3:1, so I sigh called, and here is the result:

Nice call. By the amount he betted on the river I assume that he really wanted you to call.
 
Matt_Burns88

Matt_Burns88

Legend
Loyaler
Joined
Aug 24, 2018
Total posts
1,504
Awards
2
GB
Chips
339
That's very sensible reasoning.
I thought, he would be more polarized like a flush or nothing. But I dont think, his play is terrible. With two pair he beat most hands, that were betting the turn for value, and if he check, those hands will generally check back. But if he lead out, maybe he can get a crying call from hand like AA, AK, KQ, KJ. And then he can just fold, if he get raised. So I guess, it was a thin valuebet. But maybe to thin considering, that near half the people responding in this thread would actually have folded bottom set, and I also thought about it. If I just had one pair, I dont think, I would have called, or at least not without a flush blocker. Like maybe I call with AhKs but not with KsJc.
That's very sensible reasoning. This is why discussing hands is so valuable. I'd love to speak to villain and see what his thought process was.
 
eetenor

eetenor

Legend
Loyaler
Joined
Mar 5, 2019
Total posts
2,207
Awards
2
Chips
223
Game is a 5$ 6-man SnG on Stars still in the first blind level. Opponent was playing VPIP 34 / PFR 22 with an AF of 1 over 119 hands. Call, fold or raise?

PokerStars, $4.56 + $0.44 - Hold'em No Limit - 10/20 (3 ante) - 5 players
Hand delivered by CardsChat - https://www.cardschat.com/hand-converter.php

UTG: 1,375 (69 bb)
CO: 2,919 (146 bb)
BU (Hero): 1,405 (70 bb)
SB: 1,593 (80 bb)
BB: 1,708 (85 bb)

Pre-Flop: (45) Hero is BTN with 5♦ 5♠
2 players fold, Hero raises to 60, 1 fold, BB calls 40

Flop: (145) 5♥ 2♥ K♣ (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets 58, BB calls 58

Turn: (261) 7♠ (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets 157, BB calls 157

River: (575) 9♥ (2 players)
BB bets 314, Hero?
Is it common for your V to be well balanced here?
Does your player pool call this river sizing most often in your spot with 1 pair?
If the V was thin value betting two pair they would be targeting one pair hands yet your range has flush draws that rep the K on the turn as well as many Kx flushes
We then think what are their bluffs when they do not polarize the sizing?

How bad is this player to not understand the above?
Are they just good enough to lead flushes only but not too big so you do not fold

If we raise do we get worse to call? Do we get flushes to fold?
 
Full Flush Poker
Top