$322 NLHE Deep Stacked: call or fold?

[Skidmark]

$322 NL HE Deep Stacked: call or fold?

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em Tournament, 25/50 Blinds (6 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
BB (t3555)
OkanT (UTG) (t1952)
MP (t2803)
CO (t2885)
Button (t3655)
SB (t3150)
OkanT's M: 26.03
Preflop: OkanT is UTG with J

, J

OkanT bets t140, 1 fold, CO calls t140, Button calls t140, 2 folds
Flop: (t495) 7

, 3

, Q

(3 players)
OkanT bets t396, CO raises to t2745 (All-In), 1 fold, OkanT ?????????

 

[SavagePenguin]

Either he's bluffing with a flush draw or you are crushed.

If you had half your chips in already I don't see him bluffing here as you're too likely to call. However, with only 1/4 of your chips in he knows you can still get away from a non-premium holding, which makes it a good spot to semi-bluff with pocket spades.

If you bail you have 1,400 chips with 25/50 blinds, which is still workable.

Are people in $322 games apt to look up a bet like this?
I player lower stakes games, and people look it up all the time, so if I'm i the villain's shoes I shove for value when I hit (and to give the flush draw bad odds).

 

[Skidmark]

why do you think he will play any hand that crushes me that fast with button still to act?
my thought proccess was like that; i didnt put him on any set because i didnt think he would want to chase the button and me away, imo the board is dry enough to slow play, i also excluded AQ for that same reason. So i got only KsQx, 88,99,TT , and flush draws sometimes with a 7 left for his range and/so i made the call.

 

[ozvillain]

and....what d'he have?

 

[Skidmark]

set of 3s. still cant figure why someone would fast play a set in that spot.

 

[Xavier]

set of 3s. still cant figure why someone would fast play a set in that spot.

To make it look like a shove with a flush draw with AJ of spades or similar?

My thinking would be the fact that hes shoved all in against 2 players not one makes it less like he would have 88 - 1010, as either of you could have a queen, unless he is very loose.

I would fold in the absence of a sepcific read as I don't think you're doing well against his range.
If he has a queen you're crushed and you've not even that big a favourite against a hand like A10 of spades.

 

[Skidmark]

if he had a flush draw, i had good odds to call.
i totally excluded ver strong hands ( sets and AQ ) because the board is too dry. So in my mind i left him with KsQx, TT, 99,88 and flush draws, apparently i was wrong.
but i still think his line here is terrible.

 

[Poker Orifice]

if he had a flush draw, i had good odds to call.
i totally excluded ver strong hands ( sets and AQ ) because the board is too dry. So in my mind i left him with KsQx, TT, 99,88 and flush draws, apparently i was wrong.
but i still think his line here is terrible.

It's not that terrible if his play adds deception, having you put him on something different & potentially get your stack in. A raise to ~400 would look far stronger imo (& am guessing you'd fold)... the shove adds deception... a 'wtf?'.. I think flatting by him woulda sucked.

 

[Skidmark]

you are forgetting there is still one more person to act after him. And he shoves over my standart cbet as i am the preflop raiser on a very dry board which i will only call with a Q, or a nut fd or a better set and in this case JJ. this is not a lot of combinations.

 

[ozvillain]

the shove also potentially knocks out anyone on a low fd - so not a terrible play - plus does he have any kind of read on you - had you played against him before?

If he knows you re likely to read a shove as a draw/bluff and call, then it s a great play.

 

[Skidmark]

it was still early in the tournament and i didnt recognize him before

 

[Jillychemung]

why do you think he will play any hand that crushes me that fast with button still to act?

Why would he flat call you and allow the BTN to have great odds to peel another card to hit his FD or over-set? IMHO this is a standard shove by the villain, he makes FD and over pairs play for their stacks plus villain can play his big draws the same way.

 

[Zybomb]

Even ignoring the benefits of fast playing here, I think villain simply has to fast play a set here to balance out the times he is shoving 88-TT and flush draws

 

[Mortis]

I wouldn't have guessed him on a set of 3's.. then again, sets are the hardest hand to put people on, imo.

Either he's bluffing with a flush draw or you are crushed.

That's what I was thinking.. either the nut flush draw or AQ - KQ.