$3 NLHE STT: 6max: 3 way pot, flopped set, flush draw vs. two opponents

mrdeedreid

mrdeedreid

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Early in game.

Blinds: t15/30

Opponents: BB-loose passive, CO-unkown

Stack sizes:

SB: (Hero) t1,065 with :5h4: :5d4:
BB: t1,790
CO: t3,605
Button: t665

Preflop:

CO: limp
Button: fold
Hero: limp
BB: min raise
CO + Hero: call

Total Pot: t180

Flop:

:2d4: Ad :5s4:

Action:

Hero: bet t30
*BB: reraise t60
**CO: reraise t90
Hero: call
BB: reraise t120
CO: call
Hero: shove

BB and CO call.

(Question: *BB bet is a 3bet, **CO bet is a 4bet, right? I should know this basic stuff, but I'm not sure if the terminology is appropriate here.)
 
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matiusaa

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Why do you raise too little on the flop? Your opponents could just flat call and a flush can come on the turn. I would bet 2/3 of the pot more or less. Your hand is strong, but why are you giving your opponents cheap chances of getting a better one?
 
mrdeedreid

mrdeedreid

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I limped because of the loose BB who had been calling the majority of hands.

I didn't want to scare him off/fold in the hopes that I did hit a set. I figured by doing this I had a better shot at building my chip stack and maybe knocking out a player or two.

A 2-3x BB raise would have been better to show that I had a solid hand but I didn't want to convey that to him or the other players.

My thinking was cheap flop, then, if you hit, SLOW ROLL (except I bet out first, lol, oh boy). If you miss the flop, check through the hand unless someone raises. In that case, easy muck.

With the amount of post-flop action, I figured it was likely that at least one opponent had a flush draw or maybe Ax.

I wanted to put the pressure on the other two and just ship it once I put them on the hands just mentioned above. Probably better odds against one though instead of two.

Maybe just a call after BB reraised to t120 post flop would have been safer? All I thought was "I have the best hand, I know what they have, make them make the tough decision and just shove it in." Didn't think about odds of both of them hitting.
 
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WiZZiM

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I limped because of the loose BB who had been calling the majority of hands.
Limping this is fine
I didn't want to scare him off/fold in the hopes that I did hit a set. I figured by doing this I had a better shot at building my chip stack and maybe knocking out a player or two.
They have both raised, you won't scare anyone off, they just told you they like their hands. get it in now before a scare card hits, or charge them for draws if they want to chase it.
A 2-3x BB raise would have been better to show that I had a solid hand but I didn't want to convey that to him or the other players.
Don't worry about what other players think, most of them are incapable of looking beyond their cards. just raise when you have it, keep it simple. and don't overthink things. All i'm thinking about when i hit trips here on a draw heavy board against weak players is how to get the money in before the river/before a bad card hits that puts me in a tough situation where i might have to fold/get bluffed.

My thinking was cheap flop, then, if you hit, SLOW ROLL (except I bet out first, lol, oh boy). If you miss the flop, check through the hand unless someone raises. In that case, easy muck.

There's a time and place for slowplaying, here the board is wet, and draw heavy. there's an ace on the board, bad players tend to overvalue Ax type hands, and will not fold them postflop. You have two players that have raised you, telling you that they have a hand that they like. this is the perfect time not to slowplay but to put a big committing bet out there so your decision on turns is really easy, you could even shove here if you wanted, i'd prefer to make it like 6-700 here and expect calls almost 100% of the time, if not get shoved on.

With the amount of post-flop action, I figured it was likely that at least one opponent had a flush draw or maybe Ax. Confirms that slowplaying here isn't the best route.

I wanted to put the pressure on the other two and just ship it once I put them on the hands just mentioned above. Probably better odds against one though instead of two. Ya, but you called the original raise, and you were lucky that it got re-raised back, most of the time he just calls there and we face a tough turn if a diamond hits.

Maybe just a call after BB reraised to t120 post flop would have been safer? All I thought was "I have the best hand, I know what they have, make them make the tough decision and just shove it in." Didn't think about odds of both of them hitting.This is called being "results orientated", you have the best hand on the flop nearly 100% of the time here, usually in these spots you are up against Ax type hands, or draws, or combinations of both, we have tons of equity against that, plus even if someone turns a flush, we still have outs to the full house ;). getting it in on this flop against two players is absolutely fine
..


And your terminology is fine above in the OP.

however, slowrolling is different to slowplaying. google it. and please don't slowroll people unless they deserve it! :p
 
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Scrover

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Aces alert! Aces alert! Get the battleship and flee! I would be inclined to fold here and what would seem to be a hero fold, but you have been min raised preflop and on the flop, I would just raise it back a bit and see what happens. If you get min clicked by BB, they almost always have aces. Although there is the argument for shoving because it is too strong to fold.

As for CO's range, 43s is my guess. CO could also have called with AK or two pair, but unlikely.
 
Jacki Burkhart

Jacki Burkhart

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Aces alert! Aces alert! Get the battleship and flee! I would be inclined to fold here and what would seem to be a hero fold, but you have been min raised preflop and on the flop, I would just raise it back a bit and see what happens. If you get min clicked by BB, they almost always have aces. Although there is the argument for shoving because it is too strong to fold.

As for CO's range, 43s is my guess. CO could also have called with AK or two pair, but unlikely.

you cannot live in fear of set over set in a tournament setting. if he has aces, good for him, move on to the next tournament. Don't fold your set on this flop. Maybe on the turn if the flush comes and they are both still betting like crazy...but never fold on this flop.

Preflop play is fine. Exactly how I would play it.

On the flop, I like that you are leading out here. but the bet size is horrible and accomplishes almost nothing. This is not a good spot to slow play because

1) it is a multiway pot. tend to play multiway pots straightforward as it's more likely somebody has connected and will come along
2) with draws present you want to both charge the draw to chase, AND you want to get the money in while you know you're a favorite and before an action killing card comes.

Pretend the turn is a :4d4: now you're unlikely to get paid off by a naked ace. So whether or not they have the flush draw, diamonds on the turn are bad for you.

I'd lead the flop for at least half the pot (90) up to about 2/3 pot (120).

It was nice for you that they 3bet and 4bet you so you could correct your mistake. You could potentially re-raise again on the flop to less than all in (this would be a 5 bet) something like 450...but since that is almost half your stack it basically turns your hand face up anyways...so why not go for max value while you know you're ahead? I like the jam on the flop.
 
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