$20 6-seater: AA on the bubble

ChuckTs

ChuckTs

Legend
Both opponents were very LAG during the first 3/4 of the tourney, but have tightened up with the blinds rising. They are generally pretty LAP preflop.

I'm still playing fairly tight, but am loosening up from my normal 'rock' image from early in the tourney.

What do you do on the flop? Is this an easy push?

It seems like a simple question, but the flop fits any medium pair (set) or high cards perfectly (possible straight w/KQ). It's basically the definition of an action flop.

How would you play the flop had your opponents been tight?

fulltiltpoker Game #1185381002: $20 + $2 Sit & Go (8150043), Table 1 - 40/80 - No Limit Hold'em - 16:59:48 ET - 2006/11/02
Seat 3: mudd_n_gold (2,230)
Seat 4: Aaron1211 (3,750)
Seat 5: ChuckTs (3,020)
ChuckTs posts the small blind of 40
mudd_n_gold posts the big blind of 80
The button is in seat #4
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to ChuckTs [Ah Ac]
Aaron1211 raises to 160
ChuckTs raises to 600
mudd_n_gold calls 520
Aaron1211 calls 440
*** FLOP *** [9d Ts Js]
ChuckTs.............
 
gord962

gord962

Legend
What a $h1tty flop for you. I think you have to push here and take your chances. You do NOT want any callers, you simply want to take the pot down RIGHT NOW. If you are behind right now, that's the chance you have to take.
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

Legend
Another thing I thought I'd mention is the fact that it was pretty tough to play these guys shorthanded. Usually my opponents are a little tighter, making blind steals much easier; but these guys were either limp-calling, or they'd get the hell out of my way when I'd raise because of my super-tight image.

Against two tight players in the same situation, I don't think it's that farfetched to say fold the hand and pound on their blinds. But these guys were different in that they couldn't be pushed around PF really. During this hand I felt that I had to make the most out of it because of this, instead of just giving up on the superscary flop.

Any more opinions?
What a $h1tty flop for you. I think you have to push here and take your chances. You do NOT want any callers, you simply want to take the pot down RIGHT NOW. If you are behind right now, that's the chance you have to take.
What would you do if they were tight players, gord? Same deal?
 
D

Dingodaddy23

Guest
I think you can check this flop and re-evaluate when it comes back to you.
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

Legend
Well IMO, a push was necessary here. I definitely didnt want to give QJ or a spade draw a cheap turn card.

If I bet 2/3 or 3/4 the pot here, I'm nearly putting my whole stack in and won't have enough on the turn to have any fold equity. Although a push is pretty scary here, I think it's a must here vs two very loose opponents.

versus two tight players, I might just check and see what the turn brought and then play accordingly; I think I have to play this hand though regardless who my opponents are because this is 3-handed, and really my opponents could have a wide range of hands.

I thought for a while, then pushed. One of my opponents also took a long time to decide, but ended up calling:

FullTiltPoker Game #1185381002: $20 + $2 Sit & Go (8150043), Table 1 - 40/80 - No Limit Hold'em - 16:59:48 ET - 2006/11/02
Seat 3: mudd_n_gold (2,230)
Seat 4: Aaron1211 (3,750)
Seat 5: ChuckTs (3,020)
ChuckTs posts the small blind of 40
mudd_n_gold posts the big blind of 80
The button is in seat #4
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to ChuckTs [Ah Ac]
Aaron1211 raises to 160
ChuckTs raises to 600
mudd_n_gold calls 520
Aaron1211 calls 440
*** FLOP *** [9d Ts Js]
ChuckTs bets 2,420, and is all in
mudd_n_gold folds
Aaron1211 calls 2,420
ChuckTs shows [Ah Ac]
Aaron1211 shows [Ks Jd]
*** TURN *** [9d Ts Js] 9♥
*** RIVER *** [9d Ts Js 9h] 4♥
ChuckTs shows two pair, Aces and Nines
Aaron1211 shows two pair, Jacks and Nines
ChuckTs wins the pot (6,640) with two pair, Aces and Nines
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 6,640 | Rake 0
Board: [9d Ts Js 9h 4h]
Seat 3: mudd_n_gold (big blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 4: Aaron1211 (button) showed [Ks Jd] and lost with two pair, Jacks and Nines
Seat 5: ChuckTs (small blind) showed [Ah Ac] and won (6,640) with two pair, Aces and Nines

I went on to win it HU against the other player who got strangely tight and basically check-folded every hand thereafter.
 
D

Dingodaddy23

Guest
the reason i stated i would check the flop because it allows you to get away from your hand if there's a bet and push in front of you, but you can still Checkraise all in a single opponet
 
Schatzdog

Schatzdog

Visionary
"I went on to win it HU against the other player who got strangely tight and basically check-folded every hand thereafter."

Does that not mean he was disconnected?

I totally agree with the push too.
 
Dorkus Malorkus

Dorkus Malorkus

HELLO INTERNET
My gut reaction was "POOOOSH", and in the heat of the moment that's probably what I would have done, but the more I think about it the more I like checking here.

Reasons? Well, you're right, it is an action flop. Someone is very likely to have hit something here, and with you having bullied the table for a while villains are not going to be able to put you on the hand you have, and will probably (whether consciously or subconsciously) assign you a huge range. Therefore a check doesn't look like "Hello I have reraise preflop and am now checking to trap with my big hand", more like "Oops, you guys rumbled my steal attempt, here, someone take the pot".

Weaker hands on the flop like AQ/AT-QT/QJ-QT may well be tempted to bet small, and will then be all but commited when you push. If someone has a set, two pair, or a straight you're going busto whether you open push or c/r a small bet allin (or check-call a single push), and if the action behind you goes bet-push or push-call you can fold pretty easily, as Dingo said.
 
Irexes

Irexes

Legend
That's a very draw heavy board. There's a ton of hands you don't want seeing the turn for free and if a scare card hits you're going to be driven off this pot.

I've read the results so I know what he had, but without that I would suggest that AK, QQ, KK were realistic posibilities and possiby getting a call. If he has the set or KQ then so be it.

Anything less than your whole stack is causing you more problems as you say and even against a tight player I'm pushing this (hopefully taking the pot there) and moving on.
 
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