180-seater hand: AQ to tight pusher

ChuckTs

ChuckTs

Legend
It's the bubble of the final table and everyone is playing fairly tight. I've recently come back from a shortstack with QQ, and have made two button raises since (with KK, unbeknownst to everyone else). Villain is very tight, and slightly passive at times (12.4/5.4/1.29).

pokerstars GAME #8118610311: TOURNAMENT #41420961, $10+$1 HOLD'EM NO LIMIT - LEVEL XII (800/1600) - 2007/01/25 - 17:50:20 (ET)
Table '41420961 2' 9-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 2: ChuckTs (29507 in chips)
Seat 4: Doktor Gonzo (17108 in chips)
Seat 5: InDaNameOLuv (30270 in chips)
Seat 7: Ace9715 (15579 in chips)
Seat 9: sgislander (18177 in chips)
ChuckTs: posts the ante 75
Doktor Gonzo: posts the ante 75
InDaNameOLuv: posts the ante 75
Ace9715: posts the ante 75
sgislander: posts the ante 75
Ace9715: posts small blind 800
sgislander: posts big blind 1600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to ChuckTs [Qh Ad]
ChuckTs: raises 3200 to 4800
Doktor Gonzo: folds
InDaNameOLuv: folds
Ace9715: folds
sgislander: raises 13302 to 18102 and is all-in
ChuckTs:....

What's our calling range here?

(pot is at 24077 and it's 13302 to call giving us 1.8:1 pot odds)
 
t1riel

t1riel

Legend
Toughdecision here. If the villain is very tight here, I'm guessing he has a pocket pair higher than 9. You may be behind but it's probably a coinflip. You are on the bubble and 2nd biggest stack. I would probably fold here. Not only are you facing a very tight player but if you call and lose, you'll be all in on the very next hand due to the big blind. If it's a bluff, it's a good bluff.
 
Ronaldadio

Ronaldadio

Legend
It a fold for me Chuck.

But as a direct answer to your question, IMO, due to the stack size and your position, my calling range would be AK, and any pair 1010+. So really, premium hands. But this is purely down to the fact u r 2nd and you will find a better situation.

Having said all of this, I think u r ahead, regardless, and the other guy is holding KQ, A10, AJ, 55+, etc. But I could be wrong, hence the fold (if this makes any kind of sense!!!)
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

Legend
Not only are you facing a very tight player but if you call and lose, you'll be all in on the very next hand due to the big blind.

I'll actually still have a little more than 11K and won't be all in.

I do see your point though; I'll be shortstacked and on the BB the very next hand.


Any more responses?
 
zebranky

zebranky

Rock Star
fold time...

definitely a fold for me. If he's a tight-passive, this should be screaming AK or better. Villian didn't have to commit all his chips (considering everyone's stacks, he's not that far behind), so I would assume he's got me one way or the other - even the coinflip is slightly in his favor.
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

Legend
Gut feeling told me to call, but I knew it was a bad call even after he showed KQd.

I was really surprised to see him push with that hand - especially with a TAG like me raising in first position. Maybe I was giving off a looser image than I'd thought :)
 
stormswa

stormswa

Legend
darn

Gut feeling told me to call, but I knew it was a bad call even after he showed KQd.

I was really surprised to see him push with that hand - especially with a TAG like me raising in first position. Maybe I was giving off a looser image than I'd thought :)

crap it was this one where he had KdQd, mixed up threads.
 
mrsnake3695

mrsnake3695

I'm confused
Why do you think it's a bad call, are you being results oriented after he hit his 3 outer?
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

Legend
Why do you think it's a bad call, are you being results oriented after he hit his 3 outer?

No, I won the hand. I think it's a bad call because I'm calling an all in with >2:1 odds with AQ vs someone I should really be only calling with AK/AKs and big pairs IMO.

My stats pinned him as a very tight player, and at times he was passive. Do you really see a tight player pushing here with <AJ or KQ of all hands?

His stack was also in no need of pushing without a very strong hand. I'm genuinely confused as to why he pushed with KQ; maybe he just got sick of a bad run of cards and thought he could make a big steal.
 
stormswa

stormswa

Legend
well

No, I won the hand. I think it's a bad call because I'm calling an all in with >2:1 odds with AQ vs someone I should really be only calling with AK/AKs and big pairs IMO.

My stats pinned him as a very tight player, and at times he was passive. Do you really see a tight player pushing here with <AJ or KQ of all hands?

His stack was also in no need of pushing without a very strong hand. I'm genuinely confused as to why he pushed with KQ; maybe he just got sick of a bad run of cards and thought he could make a big steal.


or maybe he thought that you all had seen that he is tight and tried mixing it up thinking you would fold. He made move got caught and lost....happens.
 
mrsnake3695

mrsnake3695

I'm confused
Actually I can kinda see it. He only has about 11 times the BB so he will have to make a move soon and KQ is not a bad hand. You have made some recent bets and won without a showdown so he could figure you might have a less than premium hand and can bet you off of it and win a decent pot. Any reraise he makes almost has to be an all-in since a mini-raise is stupid and pot commits him anyway. I think it would have been better for him to call and push any flop without and ace which would have prob taken down the pot.

He prob figured he was in a fold or push situation and didn't want to fold. Psycology takes a part here too, if he had been card dead for awhile KQ looks alot stronger than it is.
 
Bombjack

Bombjack

Legend
Well you're almost getting the right odds to call if he has QQ / KK so it's call for me. It's only a really bad call if he has AA / AK, bad fold otherwise.
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

Legend
Well you're almost getting the right odds to call if he has QQ / KK so it's call for me. It's only a really bad call if he has AA / AK, bad fold otherwise.

Tournament play is much different than cash games. Just because you have odds to call in a tournament doesn't necessarily make it a 'proper' call. I'm not sure what the 'accepted' % is for getting your money in, but I personally try to make sure I don't get my money in as less than a 60/40 shot (with me as the favourite obv), preferrably 70/30 or better. With a hand like this I've got to be getting pretty damn good odds to call, or at least a solid read that I've got him dominated.

I dunno; maybe this is a tighter situation than I'd thought, but I'm still leaning towards a fold. My actual thought process went: I'm ahead - call, then rethought it and nearly folded considering his stats, then "gotta gamble to win big!" and I decided to take a chance.
 
Ronaldadio

Ronaldadio

Legend
I must be getting better

Gut feeling told me to call, but I knew it was a bad call even after he showed KQd.

I was really surprised to see him push with that hand - especially with a TAG like me raising in first position. Maybe I was giving off a looser image than I'd thought :)

Check out my earlier quote, but I did say I would have folded :confused:
 
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