$15 NLHE MTT: $$15 NLHE MTT: $15 MTT JTo in the SB

royalburrito24

royalburrito24

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What do we think of my turn action here? This is early in the tournament, and I have no reads on villain. Normally a 9 handed table, this particular hand was only 6 handed while ACR attempted to rebalance tables.

Winning Poker, Hold'em No Limit - 115/230 (28 ante) - 6 players
Hand delivered by CardsChat

Allybee888 (UTG): 17,586 (76 bb)
Gever (MP): 21,267 (92 bb)
reedmns (CO): 20,931 (91 bb)
jphish04 (BU): 17,869 (78 bb)
royalburrito24 (SB): 23,481 (102 bb)
PANVLAD (BB): 19,891 (86 bb)

Pre-Flop: (513) Hero (royalburrito24) is SB with T J
4 players fold, royalburrito24 (SB) raises to 736, PANVLAD (BB) calls 506

Flop: (1,640) 4 3 8 (2 players)
royalburrito24 (SB) bets 920, PANVLAD (BB) calls 920

Turn: (3,480) 9 (2 players)
royalburrito24 (SB) bets 2,300, PANVLAD (BB) calls 2,300

River: (8,080) 6 (2 players)
royalburrito24 (SB) checks, PANVLAD (BB) bets 6,060, royalburrito24 (SB) folds
 
Edu1

Edu1

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I think this hand shouldn't be played like that, unnecessary aggressive play imho
looks like you're playing with JJ instead of TJ
in this line you played, the turn action is cbet of course
but if the preflop and flop had been played differently is check turn fold river
 
royalburrito24

royalburrito24

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I think this hand shouldn't be played like that, unnecessary aggressive play imho
looks like you're playing with JJ instead of TJ
in this line you played, the turn action is cbet of course
but if the preflop and flop had been played differently is check turn fold river


How would you suggest playing this pre flop?
 
Edu1

Edu1

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How would you suggest playing this pre flop?

I think there's no mystery, at the beginning of the tournament and no reads on villain
I think the standard play is to open 2x (500)
the pos-flop will depend on each one's playing style
 
royalburrito24

royalburrito24

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I think there's no mystery, at the beginning of the tournament and no reads on villain
I think the standard play is to open 2x (500)
the pos-flop will depend on each one's playing style


As I said, there are no reads on villain’s playing style.

It would be helpful for me to have reasons behind your suggestions. Opening to 2bb because it’s “the standard play” doesn’t cut it for me.

I open to 3.25bb from the SB because the effective stack sizes are so large. Normally with effective stack sizes this large, I raise to 2.75bb, adding .5bb if I’m opening from the SB since I’ll be playing the hand out of position, and my perceived opening range is so wide. I’m gonna need that extra bit in my bet to make sure I have decent fold equity.

If I’m villain in BB I can call any 2 with my stack size and facing a 2bb open from the SB. I’ll be playing the hand in position, and have made it rather impossible for my opponent to narrow my range down very much.



I believe my opening size was fine, but perhaps checking on the flop is a good idea as it could’ve hit my opponents range pretty good. Then bet the turn if opponent checked behind on flop and bet or check the river depending on what spits out.

I’m still not sure though, so I’m looking for guidance with decent explanations. “Standard play” doesn’t compute in my mind.
 
Edu1

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As I said, there are no reads on villain’s playing style.

It would be helpful for me to have reasons behind your suggestions. Opening to 2bb because it’s “the standard play” doesn’t cut it for me.

I open to 3.25bb from the SB because the effective stack sizes are so large. Normally with effective stack sizes this large, I raise to 2.75bb, adding .5bb if I’m opening from the SB since I’ll be playing the hand out of position, and my perceived opening range is so wide. I’m gonna need that extra bit in my bet to make sure I have decent fold equity.

If I’m villain in BB I can call any 2 with my stack size and facing a 2bb open from the SB. I’ll be playing the hand in position, and have made it rather impossible for my opponent to narrow my range down very much.



I believe my opening size was fine, but perhaps checking on the flop is a good idea as it could’ve hit my opponents range pretty good. Then bet the turn if opponent checked behind on flop and bet or check the river depending on what spits out.

I’m still not sure though, so I’m looking for guidance with decent explanations. “Standard play” doesn’t compute in my mind.



but again, you are holding TJ not JJ
in the flop you had nothing, in the turn a straight draw to 7 (but river is 6)

"decent explanations" I'm not understanding you
you wanna a new crazy strategy? I think nobody discover yet
TJ is a weak hand preflop, accept that
if you want to play with your "perceptive range" is better had at least a Ace in your hand
 
royalburrito24

royalburrito24

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but again, you are holding TJ not JJ
in the flop you had nothing, in the turn a straight draw to 7 (but river is 6)

"decent explanations" I'm not understanding you
you wanna a new crazy strategy? I think nobody discover yet
TJ is a weak hand preflop, accept that
if you want to play with your "perceptive range" is better had at least a Ace in your hand


Hand strengths are relative to their position and the situation. JTo UTG is weak, JTo in the SB is far stronger when it’s been folded to you. Opponents get pairs on the flop only 35% of the time, making c-bets almost 100% of the time rather profitable, regardless of the board and my hand.
 
royalburrito24

royalburrito24

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but again, you are holding TJ not JJ
in the flop you had nothing, in the turn a straight draw to 7 (but river is 6)

"decent explanations" I'm not understanding you
you wanna a new crazy strategy? I think nobody discover yet
TJ is a weak hand preflop, accept that
if you want to play with your "perceptive range" is better had at least a Ace in your hand

By “decent explanation”, I want REASONS WHY you prefer a 2bb raise. I want explanations beyond “that’s a bad preflop hand, accept that fact”

Many pots are won long before going to showdown. Giving up just because I missed the flop is a mistake. Players will be able to read me like a book and exploit me to no end if I only bet on flops I hit, and check on flops I miss. Obviously, if my opponent had something, I lose no matter what, but it’s quite possible my opponent had weak holdings too, but just outplayed me.

I suppose my question is, could I have won this pot without going to showdown by playing it a different way?
 
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