$11 NLHE MTT Turbo: $$11 NLHE MTT Turbo: $$11 NLHE MTT Turbo: Shove on the flop?

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Ianmacca99

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$11 turbo rebuy
Past the late reg rebuy stage
Blinds 1200/600/ 250ante
Hero on btn with J9d 24bb raises to 2700
Sb calls 16bb
big blind calls 30bb
Pot 9400
Flop Js 4c 9s

Sb leads for 2500
Bb raises to 7500
Hero??

Do I look to get it in here as a 60/40 favorite against draws or flat allowing the sb to probably come along too and look to proceed on safe turns
I think I'd of heard of Jacks or 9s pre so only set is really 4s

I'd seen bb play draws aggressively previously and sb had also lead with weak holdings in a previous hand against me he held bottom pair
 
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fundiver199

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Yes I think, this is a very easy jam given the stack sizes, the action and the board texture. You essentially have the nuts right now, but a lot of turn cards are going to make your decisions more difficult. If SB has some kind of draw, he might go with it anyway, since he is so short. And as for BB few people are able to raise for value and then fold to a 3-bet. So if he has a hand like AJ or KJ, you are likely to get action from him, which is an absolutely great situation for you. If on the other hand he is on a draw and fold, thats totally fine as well, because then you protect your stack.
 
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Ianmacca99

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Yes I think, this is a very easy jam given the stack sizes, the action and the board texture. You essentially have the nuts right now, but a lot of turn cards are going to make your decisions more difficult. If SB has some kind of draw, he might go with it anyway, since he is so short. And as for BB few people are able to raise for value and then fold to a 3-bet. So if he has a hand like AJ or KJ, you are likely to get action from him, which is an absolutely great situation for you. If on the other hand he is on a draw and fold, thats totally fine as well, because then you protect your stack.
Thanks for the input I indeed jammed sb folded so I imagine he was leading weak and BB called holding K6s turn brought 2s to hit his flush and I was unable to improve and was out. I was just checking to see if my line was optimal
 
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fundiver199

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You got it in with 64,4% equity, and thats a situation, we should be completely happy with. If you just call and then fold on a spade turn, you might end up folding the best hand, since his entire range is not flushdraws. For me you played this hand in the best possible way. Just did not work out this time :)
 
vsawake01

vsawake01

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... So if he has a hand like AJ or KJ, you are likely to get action from him, which is an absolutely great situation for you. ...

Disagree:
0. Raise to BTN + SB too strong or too bluffing (I do not believe). I think this is value
1. Strong J (AJ, KJ, even QJ) and top pairs 3-bet/squeeze range vs BTN + SB (depend on player). Same for AA KK QQ vs 2 players. No AJ in range, more likely no KJs.
2. I don't think this is weak draw. No value here.
3. Strong draw possible ( even more with Xs) => stack difference, high fold equity.
4. Flash draw possible => stack difference, high fold equity.
5. Numerous of flash card in range (in multi-pot even more). Let's say about 50.
6. 61% vs 26% on flop
7. Any "your" card. 73% vs 20%. And very hard to bet more
8. No fold equity vs so aggressive.
9. ITM - 500 players -> 80 in ITM. Call and fold on s -> you still in play with 15BB
 
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Badday94

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I did this exact same move plenty of times and I can say I lost more than I have won. Everytime they call with a flush draw and more times then not, they hit it. I get that it is not a bad play and it's what you should do, but overall in my experience it didn't turn well. So what I like to do is wait and see the turn card also. If the turn card is good for me, then I jam. Jamming on the flop is too desperate in my opinion, you don't have to win them all. I prefer being a little tighter in this situation and live to see another day :) this is what I prefer doing when I flop a flush with lower cards also. He might have a flush draw with ace or king high, so I prefer seeing the turn and then being super aggressive.
 
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