$1.50 NLHE STT Turbo: Open-Ended Straights on the Flop

[Creepy Jackalope]

Situations like this have always left me a little unsure. I like my pre-flop call as I'm closing the action in a multi-way pot, but I'm pretty much set-mining.

Hitting the open ender is a bit of a situation.. especially because I hold 2 of the 4 "nut high" type cards to the straight.

I think that I was set-mining and missed, and I don't want to flat here, miss the turn and then have to face another bet...

Best to fold and keep a nice continuing stack.. right? Am I missing anything I should be considering?

I didn't have many hands on the villain.. but the little I had seen led me to believe that he was a touch loose/agro.


pokerstars No-Limit Hold'em, 1.5 Tournament, 25/50 Blinds (7 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from http://www.flopturnriver.com

UTG (t1,485)
MP1 (t2,270)
MP2 (t1,415)
CO (t1,170)
Button (t1,185)
Hero (SB) (t1,645)
BB (t4,330)

Hero's M: 21.93

Preflop: Hero is SB with 6

, 6

1 fold, MP1 calls t50, 2 folds, Button calls t50, Hero calls t25, BB raises to t150, MP1 calls t100, Button calls t100, Hero calls t100

Flop: (t600) 4

, 5

, 3

(4 players)
Hero checks, BB bets t300, 2 folds, Hero ??

 

[hffjd2000]

I have to call here even though I know Im behind. I want to know what will he do on the turn and evaluate from there.

 

[Creepy Jackalope]

I have to call here even though I know Im behind. I want to know what will he do on the turn and evaluate from there.

Ya curiosity has killed this cat a few times too lol.

In fairness though, I guess I can call here and still have an ok continuing stack if I fold turn... ?

 

[ravpl]

I will call too in this situation. This is turbo tournament so u need to catch something to double up.

 

[WiZZiM]

the preflop call is marginal at best, once we call preflop, we kind of have to complete the extra 100 chips. in future, just fold this preflop, we can't profitably setmine at the 25/50 level, unless we're willing to do tricky things postflop, like stab at dry boards. it's best just to fold at this level and beyond.

postflop, even though our hand is actually pretty strong on that board, we can't just call and hope to hit. so our options are really to fold like we planned preflop, or shove all in and hope he folds something like an overplayed aq/ak.

op- reads on villian would help a lot. he has a stack, so he's likely aggressive? has he been raising and betting alot beforehand? if so, we might want to shove here. hell, we actually probably have the best hand here a decent amount of the time, especially if the bb is loose and aggro.

 

[Creepy Jackalope]

the preflop call is marginal at best, once we call preflop, we kind of have to complete the extra 100 chips. in future, just fold this preflop, we can't profitably setmine at the 25/50 level, unless we're willing to do tricky things postflop, like stab at dry boards. it's best just to fold at this level and beyond.

You think calling 25 chips with a pocket pair when there is 175 chips on the table is marginal at best?

I don't even mind calling the extra 100 in this spot.. certainly getting odds to set mine here aren't we?

I'm no ICM wiz or anything.. am I missing something?

I'm just a little surprised.. pre-flop seemed super standard to me....

 

[suby_rafael]

Consider a raise

I think this is a good opportunity for a check raise, as your hand has decent value whatever your opponent has unless he has the virtual nuts ofcourse which is pretty rare. So the reason i think you should raise is because it can put pressure on him to make a tough decision. If he calls i would shove the turn as even if you are behind it would not be an easy call and you would have outs if you are behind.
On the other hand calling on the flop is a conservative play and if you complete your straight on the turn then getting value can be tough unless the player is loose.

 

[el_magiciann]

I think you can call here, it is not wrong to fold if you think this is the right decision, i would call 80% of the time and see the turn if it is good one i will be happy if not fold and wait for better spot, your stack still will be looking good!

 

[suby_rafael]

how can you fold ?

@el magician i don't get it why you think it is not wrong to fold to the flop bet. On a 3,4,5 board i think it is a very bad idea to fold. This is a turbo event, the blinds will be up fast and i think folding hands of such good value on the flop is being even knittier than Chris Ferguson

 

[Arjonius]

I don't even mind calling the extra 100 in this spot.. certainly getting odds to set mine here aren't we?

It depends what odds you feel you should have to set mine. In this case you're calling 100 with about 1500 behind, so your implied odds are 15:1. Your odds of flopping a set are better than this, but a set won't always win or get paid off, so 15:1 is about the least I'd consider.

 

[Arjonius]

I think this is a good opportunity for a check raise, as your hand has decent value whatever your opponent has unless he has the virtual nuts ofcourse which is pretty rare. So the reason i think you should raise is because it can put pressure on him to make a tough decision. If he calls i would shove the turn as even if you are behind it would not be an easy call and you would have outs if you are behind.

You have 1500. Check-raising the flop pretty much pot commits you, so why leave any chips back to shove on the turn?

 

[WiZZiM]

You think calling 25 chips with a pocket pair when there is 175 chips on the table is marginal at best?

I don't even mind calling the extra 100 in this spot.. certainly getting odds to set mine here aren't we?

I'm no ICM wiz or anything.. am I missing something?

I'm just a little surprised.. pre-flop seemed super standard to me....

ops, i stand corrected.

didn't realize we already had 25 invested with only one player left to act. i'm still likely sigh-folding this preflop to the 100 raise. we're getting ok odds, but we have to think we're also out of position the entire hand, meaning it's much harder to play our hand even when we hit a set. as arjonius mentioned, even when we hit sometimes we don't get paid, so we're really looking for at least 15:1, but I prefer this number to be higher, more like 17-20:1

 

[horizon12]

Fold in flop , in preflop you only call on set mining, villain bet vs 3 opponents and this look very strong, and our odds very bad what call...

 

[Creepy Jackalope]

ops, i stand corrected.

didn't realize we already had 25 invested with only one player left to act. i'm still likely sigh-folding this preflop to the 100 raise. we're getting ok odds, but we have to think we're also out of position the entire hand, meaning it's much harder to play our hand even when we hit a set. as arjonius mentioned, even when we hit sometimes we don't get paid, so we're really looking for at least 15:1, but I prefer this number to be higher, more like 17-20:1

Thank you. I'm not sure I'm 100% on board with this, especially in a turbo, but you make some good points. Something I am certainly going to consider!

 

[Poker Orifice]

yah I'd call the raise pre because there's a couple others who've called ahead of us. Also, I think we can assume that at the micro buyins, chances of getting paid off when we do hit our set are greater.. therefore maybe needing less than 20to1.

OP, Postflop, I'm probably crai on flop (as already posted by WIZZ)

 

[jdeliverer]

Check/shove the flop, at the 1.50 level he's c-betting all sorts of overcards and you have very good equity against an overpair. I think preflop call is fine.

 

[konatus]

I would call the 25 and fold to the 150 raise. On the flop I would bet instead of the check.

 

[kanselau]

ops, i stand corrected.

didn't realize we already had 25 invested with only one player left to act. i'm still likely sigh-folding this preflop to the 100 raise. we're getting ok odds, but we have to think we're also out of position the entire hand, meaning it's much harder to play our hand even when we hit a set. as arjonius mentioned, even when we hit sometimes we don't get paid, so we're really looking for at least 15:1, but I prefer this number to be higher, more like 17-20:1

with so many opponents in the hand and it being a low buy-in turbo with plenty of fish ,our implied odds go through the roof , yes traditional pot odds say that this is close for set mining , but there are also other things to consider that make this an easy call , especially in a tornament.

1 we need to get chips quick as in a couple of rounds we will be short stacked
2 if we hit our hand we are very likely to get paid off , we have 3 other opponents in the hand and we can assume (without reads) that they are bad in these small buyins.
3 we close the action so that no one can blow us off the hand

easy call pre
Shove flop

its a turbo people you need to play fast and get chips , otherwise blinds will eat you alive in no matter off time.

 

[Jacki Burkhart]

preflop play is standard

on the flop, check raise all in pretty much every time. If we were deep stacked we could call a reasonable bet size on the flop and possibly the turn and try and hit our draw, or re-assess our opponent's strength on later streets.

You are so far ahead of so much of his range and even if he has an overpair you're not toast... the only hands that really crush you are a set or pocket 7s. Both unlikely holdings, given the preflop action.

But because it's a turbo, and this is the absolute best flop for our hand that doesn't contain a 6.....just ship it!

 

[Arjonius]

at the 1.50 level he's c-betting all sorts of overcards

Into 3 opponents, two of whom have yet to act? And on a board where any of them could have a set?