$1.50 NLHE STT: Could you fold here?

[LuisBoaC]

30 hands in, whole table including villain have been fairly tight.

Raise bigger pre or fold the flop or any other insights?


pokerstars, $1.29 + $0.21 - Hold'em No Limit - 25/50 (6 ante) - 7 players
Replay this hand on Upswing Poker

atomsvift (UTG): 3,554 (71 bb)
luisboac (MP): 1,426 (29 bb)
xxXRiddleXxx (MP+1): 2,535 (51 bb)
FFtonny (CO): 1,149 (23 bb)
Crawood (BU): 2,991 (60 bb)
leek666 (SB): 901 (18 bb)
ramzes34ru (BB): 944 (19 bb)

Pre-Flop: (117) Hero (luisboac) is MP with K♠ K♦
atomsvift (UTG) raises to 125, luisboac (MP) 3-bets to 250, 5 players fold, atomsvift (UTG) calls 125

Flop: (617) 2♣ 6♠ 8♠ (2 players)
atomsvift (UTG) checks, luisboac (MP) bets 450, atomsvift (UTG) raises to 3,298 (all-in), luisboac (MP) calls 720 (all-in)

Turn: (2,957) 8♦ (2 players, 2 all-in)

River: (2,957) 4♠ (2 players, 2 all-in)

Total pot: 2,957

Showdown:
atomsvift (UTG) shows 6♦ 6♥ (a full house, Sixes full of Eights)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 19%, Flop: 87%, Turn: 91%, River: 100%)

luisboac (MP) shows K♠ K♦ (two pair, Kings and Eights)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 81%, Flop: 13%, Turn: 9%, River: 0%)

atomsvift (UTG) wins 2,957

 

[gabpoker]

What was your reason for min 3 betting?

 

[Nathan Smith]

When villain jams flop what range do you put him on?

After he calls your 3-bet out of position is range is condensed down to pocket pairs and AJ+. His best bluffs on this flop are 79 (unlikely) or the flush draws - you block AK spades - so he has AJ spades and AQ spades QJ spades (3 bluffs vs 9 value - 22, 66, 88 - 9 hands total). Sometimes people overvalue top pair but not on an 8 high board.

 

[alienat3d]

Hi LuisBoaC!I would definitively bet more on pre-flop, as 3-bet using something like x3 bet. I think x2 sizing is rather inviting, than isolating and with the Cowboys we're vulnerable against any Rag-Ace and there are still 5 players behind us to act.

However, on flop against 1 villain is totally fine call in my opinion. I don't think that being massively careful in poker will bring you money on the long run. It's way too nit thinking, that villain shoves there only with Aces and sets. There are many other hands he could play like that too Flush Draw with overcards, QQ, JJ, TT, 99, even A8, maybe even 77. And then again, never forget about SPR. You have 0.66 there, means you are absolutely pot committed and there is no fold anymore. Although, as i said above, i think even with bigger stack it's a fine call, because there are more possible hands we are beating, than those are beating us.

Don't fool yourself thinking, that after 30 hands you know the field and opponents, as you really don't. That's a common mistake of many players, assuming that they have an information about their opponents already after few hands. 30 hands is nothing. 150 hands.. uhm.. maybe, but not sure. Can start to be sure from 300+ i would say. Once i heard a great advice from one poker pro and coach: Just try to check your own VPIP/PFR stats after 30hands, 50hands, 100hands and 300hands. Session after session and you will see how how different they are and when you really can rely on them.
Of course, there are exceptions. You will find a maniac and super-rock pretty quickly, but what i want to tell is that 30 hands just too few to assume someone is a fairly tight player. Which you have seen by yourself there. Raising against the whole table from UTG with 66 is pretty damn LAG play. Tight players fold it all the way.

 

[sheltowee420]

could you fold.

I would have just gone all-in pre flop, take the blinds and be happy, or maybe get doubled up. If I get called and lose ten that`s just poker. Next game.....

 

[Jacki Burkhart]

make a normal 3bet sizing something like 350-400. Once called you're committed to the hand unless an A flops....and even then we can't always fold

as played the flop Cbet size is fine, we want to charge the draws. Once we are check raised we can't fold because we only have 720 back and are getting better than 3:1 pot odds from the pot. so we only need to win 24% of the time. He can have draws and overpairs. There are some players who will play 99-JJ this way.

the fact that you have the Ks makes it an even better call off because if he has a set or 2 pair you have backdoor outs.

 

[parrudao0211]

Analyze

3bet very low pre flop, in this hand only one player got involved, however in many cases several will get involved causing the KK to lose a lot, after check raise all in post flop leaves the situation very bad because there are all cracks and draws

 

[elizeuof]

I think you played well, there are some things that you can do try to avoid against specific players, if the player are so tight, and your postflop game is not so good, you need to put him on a range and try to extract more value on preflop of medium hands, very tight players will go allin in the most of time with good hands.

For me It's difficult to put another player in three of a kind, but when theres so many actions is a indicator of good cards, or a strong draw, some players make huge bets with top pair and weak kicker, overpair, overcards or weak draw, because of this I prefer call in theses situations too, unless I know the villain and had see him make good plays.

 

[Matt Vaughan]

Agree with everyone's analysis on preflop - there's no good reason to go so small so far as I can see with the given info.

missjacki is 100% right as well that as played we're never going away on this flop either. We have too little behind to consider folding since people are absolutely capable of holding 99-JJ here and just going with it on a draw heavy board.

 

[Luvepoker]

I am not sure why you would 3-bet so small here. By betting this small you are letting him call with just about anything he raised with instead of narrowing down his range. I would have raised to about 350. At this amount he would not have had the odds to set mine even though he barley did here in my opinion. I would have bet smaller on this flop as well wanting to keep him in on this flop and to control the pot size. He may not have shoved on the flop if you had bet about 1/2 pot. Once you made the bet you had to call in my opinion as you were pot committed. Yes he has sets in his range along with draws "straight and flush" but he could have any paid 99-QQ as well that you have crushed.

 

[andreigabor]

You said it very well, I like your way of thinking, there is no fold for sure, me either don t like the 2x pre-flop all the good players will make it bigger but for sure Luis want to keep this player on the flop and this is some kind of slow play and we get unlucky sometimes.

Hi LuisBoaC!I would definitively bet more on pre-flop, as 3-bet using something like x3 bet. I think x2 sizing is rather inviting, than isolating and with the Cowboys we're vulnerable against any Rag-Ace and there are still 5 players behind us to act.

However, on flop against 1 villain is totally fine call in my opinion. I don't think that being massively careful in poker will bring you money on the long run. It's way too nit thinking, that villain shoves there only with Aces and sets. There are many other hands he could play like that too Flush Draw with overcards, QQ, JJ, TT, 99, even A8, maybe even 77. And then again, never forget about SPR. You have 0.66 there, means you are absolutely pot committed and there is no fold anymore. Although, as i said above, i think even with bigger stack it's a fine call, because there are more possible hands we are beating, than those are beating us.

Don't fool yourself thinking, that after 30 hands you know the field and opponents, as you really don't. That's a common mistake of many players, assuming that they have an information about their opponents already after few hands. 30 hands is nothing. 150 hands.. uhm.. maybe, but not sure. Can start to be sure from 300+ i would say. Once i heard a great advice from one poker pro and coach: Just try to check your own VPIP/PFR stats after 30hands, 50hands, 100hands and 300hands. Session after session and you will see how how different they are and when you really can rely on them.
Of course, there are exceptions. You will find a maniac and super-rock pretty quickly, but what i want to tell is that 30 hands just too few to assume someone is a fairly tight player. Which you have seen by yourself there. Raising against the whole table from UTG with 66 is pretty damn LAG play. Tight players fold it all the way.

 

[TDTODDY]

The 3x bet is perfect to rep a good hand. When he/she shoves, that has to be an indication that your hand is no good. You have an overpair on a 8 high board w/ flush draw. The other player has check shoved. Show the big pair and move on.

 

[manolo salazar]

You have gotten really good answers. Only remember you will win in the long term. And please if you 3 bet you have to bet strong always thinking in the Effective Stack.

 

[DomGov]

In a $1.50 game? No way.
I would make that 3bet larger, at least.. 350 maybe 400+, if not bigger.
As played, I think your strategy was more pot-control, in cheaper games like this you typically want to err towards TAG style, and massive (even overbets) with your monsters such as this KK.

The sets and random two pairs are just going to happen from time to time, I think you did fine, just adjust sizing, and don't dwell too much on the result here.

 

[1player2]

30 hands in, whole table including villain have been fairly tight.

Raise bigger pre or fold the flop or any other insights?


PokerStars, $1.29 + $0.21 - Hold'em No Limit - 25/50 (6 ante) - 7 players
Replay this hand on Upswing Poker

atomsvift (UTG): 3,554 (71 bb)
luisboac (MP): 1,426 (29 bb)
xxXRiddleXxx (MP+1): 2,535 (51 bb)
FFtonny (CO): 1,149 (23 bb)
Crawood (BU): 2,991 (60 bb)
leek666 (SB): 901 (18 bb)
ramzes34ru (BB): 944 (19 bb)

Pre-Flop: (117) Hero (luisboac) is MP with K♠ K♦
atomsvift (UTG) raises to 125, luisboac (MP) 3-bets to 250, 5 players fold, atomsvift (UTG) calls 125

Flop: (617) 2♣ 6♠ 8♠ (2 players)
atomsvift (UTG) checks, luisboac (MP) bets 450, atomsvift (UTG) raises to 3,298 (all-in), luisboac (MP) calls 720 (all-in)

Turn: (2,957) 8♦ (2 players, 2 all-in)

River: (2,957) 4♠ (2 players, 2 all-in)

Total pot: 2,957

Showdown:
atomsvift (UTG) shows 6♦ 6♥ (a full house, Sixes full of Eights)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 19%, Flop: 87%, Turn: 91%, River: 100%)

luisboac (MP) shows K♠ K♦ (two pair, Kings and Eights)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 81%, Flop: 13%, Turn: 9%, River: 0%)

atomsvift (UTG) wins 2,957

Hello,


I recommend a larger raise to at least 3xBB and a 4 bet preflop when villian 3 bet hero. With kings and aces I play very aggressive preflop. I wouldn't have been able to fold here because opponent had lower pocket pairs in his range. Just a cooler