$1.29 NLHE STT: $ : Losing Hand and coming third

[Caesura]

Hold'em No Limit - Level V (75/150) - 2012/09/08 7:06:21 ET
Table '611336794 1' 9-max Seat #4 is the button
Seat 2: playerx (1905 in chips)
Seat 4: Villain(8220 in chips)
Seat 6: Hero (3375 in chips)
Hero: posts small blind 75
playerx: posts big blind 150
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [Kd Qd]
villain: raises 150 to 300
Hero: raises 3075 to 3375 and is all-in
playerx: folds
villain: calls 3075
*** FLOP *** [5c 7c 2s]
*** TURN *** [5c 7c 2s] Q♣
*** RIVER *** [5c 7c 2s Qc] 2♣
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Hero shows [Kd Qd] (two pair, Queens and Deuces)
villain: shows [Kh Ks] (two pair, Kings and Deuces)
villain collected 6900 from pot

I just put this through SNGWiz and was told I should have folded.

I just realised though, as I was posting, that I wasn't counting how many BB I had left, so it does make more sense to fold.
I shoved based on the principle of 1st or 3rd and was trying to double up whilst playerx was being a tight wad and just trying to hang on.
Think I should have been a bit more patient.

 

[WiZZiM]

The chips you gain here arnt worth the risk. You have a healthy chip lead over third place and the blinds are still low. You have ample time to use skill to chip up here.

Sng wiz or icm does not like going up against chip leaders for the above reasons. Basically it will calculate two equities for you. The equity you gain if you push here and the equity you gain when you fold. (it does a bit more than that, but to simplify)

So equity in tournaments usually refers to how much your stack is worth directly compared to the prize pool. If the prize pool is top heavy, your stack is worth less. If its like a sng and the prize pool is spread more evenly getring itm is more important and your sta,k is worth more.

So when putting this into wiz, you first need to change the opening range of villian. This is where your skill comes into play. ask yourself what type of villian is this, and try to put yourself in his shoes. Once you put in that range, then you need to think about what range he will call your shove with.

If villian raises here enough and folds a lot you will see that wiz will like this a lot more. Its not important to get these ranges exact, because thats pretty much impossible, but the more accurate they are, the more accurate the program will be.

Remember though this program is a calxulator, it cannot do anything good for your game unless you know how to use it. If yiu really want to get good, id suggest a training site as most will show use of this program. Id offer to help but i dont have internet(using my phone to posr this)

 

[WiZZiM]

Also the 1st or third isnt really a set principle anymore. its what a good players distribution looks like where 1>3>2 but i actually like the 1>2>3 the main reason i like the latter distribution(moreso for mid stakes) is that a lot of average play er s know to loosen up once the bubble burts so they tend to go a little nuts. What they dont jnow is that there is still a "mini" bubble in effect so icm still plays a small role. So i found that tightening up more than other players let me take more second places.

At the end of the day though, as long as your itm % is around 40 and your first place finishes is one of your highest it wont matter

 

[Caesura]

Thanks for that excellent reply. I'm a little disappointed in that I only just heard the 1st or 3rd concept and initially it worked ie I came first 3 times in a row and thought it was the answer I was looking for.
Just recently I've lost a lot of bubbles, about 6 in a row.
What training sites do you recommend? This is something I am very interested in.

 

[Arjonius]

Thanks for that excellent reply. I'm a little disappointed in that I only just heard the 1st or 3rd concept and initially it worked ie I came first 3 times in a row and thought it was the answer I was looking for.
Just recently I've lost a lot of bubbles, about 6 in a row.
What training sites do you recommend? This is something I am very interested in.

Three games is far too small a sample size from which to draw any decent conclusions. And as wizzim already kind of got at, it's not as simple as applying general principles across the board. Poker is a highly situational game, which means, among other things, that there are often exceptions to general principles.

 

[WiZZiM]

It will sometimes happen that you go on losing streaks like you mention. However if you jave leaks these will be worse and happen more often.

If you are having a high amount of bubbles, its usually an issue earlier on in the game, usually because players play way too tight.

Once you have a sample of around 300 games you can start to get a good idea where your game is leaking, just by looking at distribution

 

[ovitoo]

For sng players, I think the "play for first" techinque isn't important til you are hu (in other words it's not important). As opposed to mtt's, which are so top heavy that playing for first is essential in later stages.

You're first and only goal should be itm. Then worry about taking it down. Multi tabling sngs like I do, at least once every 1-2hrs you'll be a 4:1 fav hu and still lose two ai's to finish second.

That being said, In situations like this-->[big stack, medium stack(you), and small stack] You need to AVOID the big stack and TARGET the small stack...unless for some stupid reason the big stack is being overly passive.

Not sure if there is literature on this but just thought you may want to hear dif strategies. This is how I play. This is how I win.

 

[WiZZiM]

For sng players, I think the "play for first" techinque isn't important til you are hu (in other words it's not important). As opposed to mtt's, which are so top heavy that playing for first is essential in later stages.

You're first and only goal should be itm. Then worry about taking it down. Multi tabling sngs like I do, at least once every 1-2hrs you'll be a 4:1 fav hu and still lose two ai's to finish second.

That being said, In situations like this-->[big stack, medium stack(you), and small stack] You need to AVOID the big stack and TARGET the small stack...unless for some stupid reason the big stack is being overly passive.

Not sure if there is literature on this but just thought you may want to hear dif strategies. This is how I play. This is how I win.

Yes there is literature. You are describing basic icm.

 

[ovitoo]

Yes there is literature. You are describing basic icm.

For sure. Haven't studied icm this was just taught by volume. I think it's safe to say op is unfamiliar so at least I got to put it in lamens terms for him.

 

[Caesura]

Thanks, yes trying to come to terms with icm but it's not sticking yet.