$1.10 NLHE MTT: $ : $ : Did I make a big mistake here

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Peterbis

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Oct 13, 2021
Total posts
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Hallo everyone did I make a big mistake here?
There where 594 players in this tournament, we were 11 back. So on the bubble to final table. I was second last in chips.
Raises QJs from the Cutoff 20bb and got called from the small blind and big blind.
Big blind leads, so im thinking a jack but maybe with a worse kicker or maybe he leads a straight draw or flush draw. I would not lead here but maybe its good i dont know
I raise and now he jams, should i fold this hand or call?:)

pokerstars Hand #232404435883: Tournament #3321861243, $0.98+$0.12 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level XXVI (1800/3600) - 2021/12/21 18:42:42 CET [2021/12/21 12:42:42 ET]
Table '3321861243 19' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: PBPB40 (72132 in chips)
Seat 3: LuCaSLimaAAKK (175481 in chips)
Seat 4: kittymad1 (151603 in chips)
Seat 5: Paigewillow2323 (258234 in chips)
Seat 8: alexhino26 (52834 in chips)
PBPB40: posts the ante 450
LuCaSLimaAAKK: posts the ante 450
kittymad1: posts the ante 450
Paigewillow2323: posts the ante 450
alexhino26: posts the ante 450
kittymad1: posts small blind 1800
Paigewillow2323: posts big blind 3600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to PBPB40 [Qd Jd]
alexhino26: folds
PBPB40: raises 3600 to 7200
LuCaSLimaAAKK: folds
kittymad1: calls 5400
Paigewillow2323: calls 3600
*** FLOP *** [2s 9h Jh]
kittymad1: checks
Paigewillow2323: bets 7200
PBPB40: raises 14400 to 21600
kittymad1: folds
Paigewillow2323: raises 228984 to 250584 and is all-in
PBPB40: calls 42882 and is all-in
Uncalled bet (186102) returned to Paigewillow2323
*** TURN *** [2s 9h Jh] 2♦
*** RIVER *** [2s 9h Jh 2d] 3♣
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Paigewillow2323: shows [Jc Js] (a full house, Jacks full of Deuces)
PBPB40: shows [Qd Jd] (two pair, Jacks and Deuces)
Paigewillow2323 collected 152814 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 152814 | Rake 0
Board [2s 9h Jh 2d 3c]
Seat 1: PBPB40 showed [Qd Jd] and lost with two pair, Jacks and Deuces
Seat 3: LuCaSLimaAAKK (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: kittymad1 (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 5: Paigewillow2323 (big blind) showed [Jc Js] and won (152814) with a full house, Jacks full of Deuces
Seat 8: alexhino26 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
 
E

eetenor

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Hallo everyone did I make a big mistake here?
There where 594 players in this tournament, we were 11 back. So on the bubble to final table. I was second last in chips.
Raises QJs from the Cutoff 20bb and got called from the small blind and big blind.
Big blind leads, so im thinking a jack but maybe with a worse kicker or maybe he leads a straight draw or flush draw. I would not lead here but maybe its good i dont know
I raise and now he jams, should i fold this hand or call?:)

PokerStars Hand #232404435883: Tournament #3321861243, $0.98+$0.12 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level XXVI (1800/3600) - 2021/12/21 18:42:42 CET [2021/12/21 12:42:42 ET]
Table '3321861243 19' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: PBPB40 (72132 in chips)
Seat 3: LuCaSLimaAAKK (175481 in chips)
Seat 4: kittymad1 (151603 in chips)
Seat 5: Paigewillow2323 (258234 in chips)
Seat 8: alexhino26 (52834 in chips)
PBPB40: posts the ante 450
LuCaSLimaAAKK: posts the ante 450
kittymad1: posts the ante 450
Paigewillow2323: posts the ante 450
alexhino26: posts the ante 450
kittymad1: posts small blind 1800
Paigewillow2323: posts big blind 3600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to PBPB40 [Qd Jd]
alexhino26: folds
PBPB40: raises 3600 to 7200
LuCaSLimaAAKK: folds
kittymad1: calls 5400
Paigewillow2323: calls 3600
*** FLOP *** [2s 9h Jh]
kittymad1: checks
Paigewillow2323: bets 7200
PBPB40: raises 14400 to 21600
kittymad1: folds
Paigewillow2323: raises 228984 to 250584 and is all-in
PBPB40: calls 42882 and is all-in
Uncalled bet (186102) returned to Paigewillow2323
*** TURN *** [2s 9h Jh] 2♦
*** RIVER *** [2s 9h Jh 2d] 3♣
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Paigewillow2323: shows [Jc Js] (a full house, Jacks full of Deuces)
PBPB40: shows [Qd Jd] (two pair, Jacks and Deuces)
Paigewillow2323 collected 152814 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 152814 | Rake 0
Board [2s 9h Jh 2d 3c]
Seat 1: PBPB40 showed [Qd Jd] and lost with two pair, Jacks and Deuces
Seat 3: LuCaSLimaAAKK (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: kittymad1 (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 5: Paigewillow2323 (big blind) showed [Jc Js] and won (152814) with a full house, Jacks full of Deuces
Seat 8: alexhino26 folded before Flop (didn't bet)


Thank you for posting

We use ranges to decide if we have a call or not. Building a range using the Equilab free program is a very good learning experience and will turbo your skill level.
When estimating ranges we use player pool data to try to get close to a real range the
Villain would lead then shove.

Simple data points would be that many V at this stake level will lean to value with this pattern so we would not include gut shot draws in the standard V's range here. If this V were a passive Villain we would further reduce the range in Equilab to only include the best draws and best top pair hands in the range as well as the nuts of course. Passive V might also have QQ in their calling preflop then leading to stack off range.

Hope this helps
:):)
 
S

Sidetracked

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I think preflop is fine.

On the flop, I prefer not playing for stacks with a pair of Jacks, Queen kicker. If effective stacks were shallower (say 15 BBs pf) then going with your top pair would be OK. As stacks become deeper, ranges become tighter and stronger to play for stacks.

So...call flop, re-evaluate turn. If he does shove, a reluctant fold would probably have been best.
 
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Peterbis

Rising Star
Joined
Oct 13, 2021
Total posts
8
Thank you for posting

We use ranges to decide if we have a call or not. Building a range using the Equilab free program is a very good learning experience and will turbo your skill level.
When estimating ranges we use player pool data to try to get close to a real range the
Villain would lead then shove.

Simple data points would be that many V at this stake level will lean to value with this pattern so we would not include gut shot draws in the standard V's range here. If this V were a passive Villain we would further reduce the range in Equilab to only include the best draws and best top pair hands in the range as well as the nuts of course. Passive V might also have QQ in their calling preflop then leading to stack off range.

Hope this helps
:):)

Thank you this will help me a lot, will try to use equilab more and constuct ranges:)
 
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Peterbis

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Oct 13, 2021
Total posts
8
I think preflop is fine.

On the flop, I prefer not playing for stacks with a pair of Jacks, Queen kicker. If effective stacks were shallower (say 15 BBs pf) then going with your top pair would be OK. As stacks become deeper, ranges become tighter and stronger to play for stacks.

So...call flop, re-evaluate turn. If he does shove, a reluctant fold would probably have been best.


Yes you are so right, its not a good kicker, better when you are shorter stacked:)

Could you maybe fold these trouble hands, so late in the tournament or should you always raise this hand from the cutoff

Thank you so much:)
 
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Sidetracked

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I really do think that opening QJdd if fine.

Just playing more cautiously post flop. If you had found a fold on the turn to his shove, you'd still have had about 15 BBs, which still gives you plenty of play.
 
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popstani

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Pre flop it’s ok, and I will call flop bet to, but when he jam all in on the turn, well with one pair and not the best kicker, I would really think to call. I would fold, even if I think that he make move on me. It really smells fishy, that he leads, and jams on you, and in this situation you have only a bluff cacher. So, in the end, I think that you need to fold here, even if you think that you have been bluffed, and find a better spot to play for stacks.
 
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fundiver199

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I put your hand through the Hand Converter here on CC, so its much easier to read.

Preflop
Standard open and min-raising is fine with your stack size.

Flop
Obviously we are not folding top pair facing a 1/3 pot donk bet, so the only question is, do we raise or just call. And I lean towards just calling and then make some decisions later. Yes there is a risk, that SB then also comes along with, whatever he has. But we give ourselfes more options, when we just call, and we have position, so I think, we can play the turn pretty well. If we raise however, its definitely with a committment mindset, so I am never folding to that 3-bet jam. You are getting better than 2:1, and the whole reason, why you raised in the first place, must be, that you think, he is leading wide enough to justify getting it in.

Results
He had top set none the less, and as the board ran out, I dont see many ways for you to fold on either turn or river. So at the end of the day the hand is just an annoying cooler. Hands like this will happen from time to time, and nothing to do about them other than register for the next tournament and be happy, that you still made a decent cash in this one.

PokerStars, $0.98 + $0.12 - Hold'em No Limit - 1,800/3,600 (450 ante) - 5 players

Hand delivered by CardsChat - https://www.cardschat.com/hand-converter.php

UTG: 52,834 (15 bb)
CO (Hero): 72,132 (20 bb)
BU: 175,481 (49 bb)
SB: 151,603 (42 bb)
BB: 258,234 (72 bb)

Pre-Flop: (7,650) Hero is CO with Q♦ J♦
1 fold, Hero raises to 7,200, 1 fold, SB calls 5,400, BB calls 3,600

Flop: (23,850) 2♠ 9♥ J♥ (3 players)
SB checks, BB bets 7,200, Hero raises to 21,600, SB folds, BB raises to 250,584 (all-in), Hero calls 42,882 (all-in)

Turn: (152,814) 2♦ (2 players, 2 all-in)

River: (152,814) 3♣ (2 players, 2 all-in)

Total pot: 152,814

Showdown:
BB shows J♣ J♠ (a full house, Jacks full of Twos)
(equity - Pre-Flop: 63%, Flop: 96%, Turn: 100%, River: 100%)

CO (Hero) shows Q♦ J♦ (two pair, Jacks and Twos)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 37%, Flop: 4%, Turn: 0%, River: 0%)

BB wins 152,814
 
rock0001

rock0001

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best postflop scenario villain is either bluffing or semi bluffing with a hand like q10 or k10 of hearts. i dont think at that stage of the tournament you should be risking your entire stack with only a pair and a decent kicker. with aj and maybe even kj you can consider calling however i dont think qj is strong enough to risk your entire stack near the bubble...
 
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