A rep for Hold’em Manager calls out partypoker

Cajin007

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Trust, but verify ......

First, as someone from America, I have ZERO access to PartyPoker. As such, I think PartyPoker is making a HUGE mistake. Yes, players are the main contributing factor in discovering issues involving the game.

Having hand-histories allows players to act as a third-party regulator for the sites. This allows players to track suspicious play habits, and technical glitches within the game.

If PartyPoker is so worried that HUD users are gaining such an advantage, why not implement a simple HUD design within it's games? Why not remove the concern, and level the playing field for everyone. If users do not wish to use the site provided HUD, give them the option to simply turn it off.

As far as BOTs, super-users, and collusional players, all PartyPoker is doing is giving them an opportunity to improve their ( Cheaters ) ability to circumvent any type of detection. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot!

If the war to create a better poker site is to kill your player base, rather then the ones committing the crimes, then a serious rethink of priorities is much needed. Removing the last line of defense, AKA hand histories, sounds like PartyPoker is throwing in the towel and giving up.

Hopefully, the Leadership at PartyPoker will rethink this strategic course of action, and reconsider what is more important:

Profit or People? :cool:
 
XYZ2123

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Cajin007 makes valid points. I'm not that familiar on the specifics. Will there be no access to hand histories at all? I can understand the decision to ban in-game HUD use, but players should still have access to and be able to download a record of the hands they participated in, if only for post-session review and analysis (to review they're own play). Then again, if sites are moving to anonymous play, not sure how much use hand histories would be since you don't know who you're playing against.
 
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Collin Moshman

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Epic post Cajin007! I'm going to be showing this to others who ask about the situation.

I'd add that for anyone who needs to keep detailed track of their own results such as for backers (and I know a lot of stakers put players on Party), it won't be possible anymore. I think that combined with the cheating concerns, you're going to have a lot of regs who leave and also a lot of recreational players.

Will be interesting to see how this plays out but I definitely agree it seems like a real mistake.
 
belizebum

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I also read that they wanted real names used and if you take new notes they will be deleted at the end of the game. Not sure how true this is? I am not sure how this is going to play out, but I guess I am going to have to take physical notes and plug in a spreadsheet.
 
nera75

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XM is just a collection of statistics. I don’t see any advantage over people who don’t have it, the decision is made by a person, not a program, it’s just an excuse for weak players, that without statistics they have fewer advantages, but the main thing is how to disassemble the base
 
terryk

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It makes sense that the "hud" people are against this,,,, $$$ Huds are a huge buisness. $$$ We have to trust the poker site we play on,,,nothing has changed.I trust Party until they give me reason not to,,,, ;)
 
MattRyder

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I don't agree with the idea of injecting anonymity into poker. That just moves the online game further away from the real thing. Poker is more than cards. It's about people playing against people. In real life everything we do is based in part on our knowledge and understanding of what people will do/how they will react in different situations based on how they have acted in the past.
 
Cajin007

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What if ....

It makes sense that the "hud" people are against this,,,, $$$ Huds are a huge buisness. $$$ We have to trust the poker site we play on,,,nothing has changed.I trust Party until they give me reason not to,,,, ;)


Terryk, would you trust a bank that told you it would no longer create bank statements?
Would you trust a corporate entity that no longer published quarterly reports?

When real money is involved, some measure of accountability must be given. By removing hand histories, Party is removing the ability of players to hold the site accountable.

Rather than making players anonymous, and removing hand histories, simply ban HUDs.

pokerstars can detect when a player is using an equity program, why can't Party detect when a player is using a HUD program? Why not first warn players that HUD use is banned, and continued use while playing will result in the players account getting confiscated?

The way PartyPoker is handling this, their business model must be hurting. Party says it's doing this to entice casual players to the site. Sounds like they need fresh fish.

Why not open PartyPoker back to U.S. players ?
 
chicopaw

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I also read that they wanted real names used and if you take new notes they will be deleted at the end of the game. Not sure how true this is? I am not sure how this is going to play out, but I guess I am going to have to take physical notes and plug in a spreadsheet.


As i read it, players playing a certain level cash game and higher will need to use real names,think it was 10/25 something like that

I do use huds which enable me to have a small knowledge of a player as it is hard to gain much info from playing tourneys only
I am totally against bots but have read info that there are already programs that will take in info from the screen in game play and in effect make this HUD Ban Ineffective

Party probably has the tools to predict whether someone is using a hud already. Being able to review hand history would allow us to keep everyone including the site from anything illegal and players colluding
 
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online poker sux anyway - it's not even real poker.
I don't care either way....
 
Kanetuck

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First, as someone from America, I have ZERO access to PartyPoker. As such, I think PartyPoker is making a HUGE mistake. Yes, players are the main contributing factor in discovering issues involving the game.

Having hand-histories allows players to act as a third-party regulator for the sites. This allows players to track suspicious play habits, and technical glitches within the game.

If PartyPoker is so worried that HUD users are gaining such an advantage, why not implement a simple HUD design within it's games? Why not remove the concern, and level the playing field for everyone. If users do not wish to use the site provided HUD, give them the option to simply turn it off.

As far as BOTs, super-users, and collusional players, all PartyPoker is doing is giving them an opportunity to improve their ( Cheaters ) ability to circumvent any type of detection. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot!

If the war to create a better poker site is to kill your player base, rather then the ones committing the crimes, then a serious rethink of priorities is much needed. Removing the last line of defense, AKA hand histories, sounds like PartyPoker is throwing in the towel and giving up.

Hopefully, the Leadership at PartyPoker will rethink this strategic course of action, and reconsider what is more important:

Profit or People? :cool:
Wow Cajin, just wow. What is wrong with these poker sites? You are exactly right. The site itself should create it's own hud. I like using a HUD. However, if a site did away with HUDS, I would just have to take more written notes. However, the cash rooms would probably suffer due to less people being able to multi table. Most of the sites I am able to play on have a hard time keeping many tables open as it is. The HUDS do allow for better decision making when multi tables are in play in my opinion. I also agree about accountability. Those hand histories are important.

I just take a hard stand on complete anonymity. I refuse to play ignition. If all the sites went Anon, I would just quit playing. I can't stand watching random people go all in, winning a few hands, then bailing to another table. At least if you have a name, you can take notes.
 
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First, as someone from America, I have ZERO access to PartyPoker. As such, I think PartyPoker is making a HUGE mistake. Yes, players are the main contributing factor in discovering issues involving the game.

Having hand-histories allows players to act as a third-party regulator for the sites. This allows players to track suspicious play habits, and technical glitches within the game.

If PartyPoker is so worried that HUD users are gaining such an advantage, why not implement a simple HUD design within it's games? Why not remove the concern, and level the playing field for everyone. If users do not wish to use the site provided HUD, give them the option to simply turn it off.

As far as BOTs, super-users, and collusional players, all PartyPoker is doing is giving them an opportunity to improve their ( Cheaters ) ability to circumvent any type of detection. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot!

If the war to create a better poker site is to kill your player base, rather then the ones committing the crimes, then a serious rethink of priorities is much needed. Removing the last line of defense, AKA hand histories, sounds like PartyPoker is throwing in the towel and giving up.

Hopefully, the Leadership at PartyPoker will rethink this strategic course of action, and reconsider what is more important:

Profit or People? :cool:



I’m always amazed. Every single forum I’ve ever been part of, there’s always that one guy who thinks he knows better than the professionals and investors running the poker sites.

Profit or people? Seriously? Is that the level of thinking that flies at Cardschat? Of course they’re out to make as much as possible.

I mean, I get it. If you never want to improve your bottom line, never try to make more money. Be at whatever penny ante grinder level you choose.

Doesn’t mean sites are wrong to try and earn more. Doesn’t make them evil. And at the end of the day, CardsChat will continue to make their percentage off of Party. That isn’t evil either

It’s called good business
 
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fundiver199

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Of course its legitimate, that a company try to increase its profit. But if that means ****ing its customers, then its also legitimate, that these customers complain about it and refuse to give the company their business.

For me personally I am never going to play at a poker site, which will not allow me to download my hand histories, or where players are anonymous. Its simply just not safe, and thats the end of the discussion, as far as I am concerned.
 
Vilgeoforc

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Without a hand history, the fish will remain fish. Why Party thinking regular players? But I think that this is a war in the history will lead to the outflow of all of the players outside of this room.
 
Max Diver

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It was excellent decision by party poker not allow any kind of software to help players. That great example should be follow by poker stars, 888Poker and all of them !
It is a unfair advantage people use those softwares.
Online Poker should be like live Poker, no cheating with softwares !
Cheers,
M.D.
 
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