I was watching a streamer on Twitch the other day. He's a winning player.

At some point in the stream, a conversation started between him and the chat about online players vs live players.

He said: "If you are winning online, then you will crush it playing live."

My first thought is that this probably isn't true, but I would like to hear some opinions on it anyway.

If there's another thread that discusses this in depth, please point to it.

Originally Posted by Dark Army

He said: "If you are winning online, then you will crush it playing live."

The main reason many people say this, is that for the most part, online players know the game well enough any many are using calculators for the math. Even though you can in live games too, not that many do this in live tables. Also, a lot of players that do only live games have a lot less experience than the typical online player, who can play many thousand hands a week. The online only person probably is a poor judge of live tells, but many live only players are poor judges of pot odds and equities. They don't have to be, but typically are.

A lot of the pros say this as well. They will say something like a $1 game online will have the same level of players as $50 live game at casinos. This is because casinos are drawing in lots of people who may have very little poker experience along with drawing in the pros. Another factor is alcohol consumption at the casinos tends to be larger than most at home online players. Sure there are sober and drunk players both places, but the frequencies are telling. Now, the statement about live players doesn't really pertain to the final table. Those who make it there are usually strong players in either online or live events.

Originally Posted by Dark Army

I was watching a streamer on Twitch the other day. He's a winning player.

At some point in the stream, a conversation started between him and the chat about online players vs live players.

He said: "If you are winning online, then you will crush it playing live."

My first thought is that this probably isn't true, but I would like to hear some opinions on it anyway.


If there's another thread that discusses this in depth, please point to it.

Its a different playing environment from online to live playing. The player will not necessarily "crush" it playing live. It could very well be the opposite depending on assistance being received in online player ie. HUD.

I think the online player has a lot of tools that the live player doesn't. For example, how well does the online player do the following things live?

• Keep up with the pot. Most online card rooms display the pot size in the User Interface directly on the table. Can an online player keep up with the pot in a live game?
• Bet sizing math. Online card rooms make it easy to bet 1/2 pot, 1/3 pot, 3/4 pot etc. Will the online player have the skills to perform the math live?
• Pay attention to player tendencies. Can an online player operate without a HUD? What are the HUD stats that help him online? How does he intend to keep track of live players in order to make player tendency decisions?
• Stay focused when getting ~25 hands per hour. Most online players multi-table, can they adjust to the perceived slow pace of the live game

There are a ton more things I can think of. I am also, like you, curious.

Originally Posted by scubed

I think the online player has a lot of tools that the live player doesn't. For example, how well does the online player do the following things live?

• Keep up with the pot. Most online card rooms display the pot size in the User Interface directly on the table. Can an online player keep up with the pot in a live game?
• Bet sizing math. Online card rooms make it easy to bet 1/2 pot, 1/3 pot, 3/4 pot etc. Will the online player have the skills to perform the math live?
• Pay attention to player tendencies. Can an online player operate without a HUD? What are the HUD stats that help him online? How does he intend to keep track of live players in order to make player tendency decisions?
• Stay focused when getting ~25 hands per hour. Most online players multi-table, can they adjust to the perceived slow pace of the live game

There are a ton more things I can think of. I am also, like you, curious.

These are good points. Online players have a visual advantage that live players must do in their head. You don't go straight from 6 months of solid online play into a Vegas poker room and own the table. You're gonna realize the absence of many things that have been taken for granted.

And just how easy is it to look at your opponents stack in a live game and estimate how many BB's he has? Good luck...

Tendencies is another good point. I imagine that online players who aren't using a HUD might have an easier time spotting which players are tight and which are loose vs players who do use a HUD. But still, without very little live experience, picking up on this stuff takes practice, especially when your mind is busy thinking about stuff you normally don't spend much time on.

And what about tells?

Perhaps the point the streamer was trying to make, is that if you become successful online, you'll have an edge on your typical, experienced live player (And most everyone below him) if you put in a reasonable amount of practice in live games using the techniques that have made you successful online.

You can dive into this in a lot of ways. The one key thing is there’s a lot more rec players live then online. Yes there’s other factors but this is honestly the biggest reason.

I believe that those who play online have an advantage over the majority of those who play live since the environment is much more competitive and to survive must be a good player.

I,m sure, that this games (live and online) are totally different. You can win in only and in that time you can loose in live poker.

Originally Posted by Dark Army

I was watching a streamer on Twitch the other day. He's a winning player.

At some point in the stream, a conversation started between him and the chat about online players vs live players.

He said: "If you are winning online, then you will crush it playing live."

My first thought is that this probably isn't true, but I would like to hear some opinions on it anyway.

If there's another thread that discusses this in depth, please point to it.

I play both online and live many, many hours of both. IMO the online player will be much more technically sound, but a great deal of time when online players transition to live, they need to adapt to two main things. 1) Pre-flop raise sizing a typical 3x blind raise will not thin the field at all in a live game. In my experience a typical raise sizing in a live game to avoid a family pot is at lease 5x the big blind. 2) Initially online players transitioning to live tend to be tell boxes. Care is needed to avoid giving away hand strength.

I do not see any advantage to the contrary the online player must overcome the fact of not being at home comfortably and not having to worry about controlling their emotions

An average online player has an advantage due to a more flexible understanding of poker situations due to a greater number of tournaments played and a deeper knowledge of poker mathematics (for example, BB range protection against CO or BTN is more accurate). An offline player has a stronger understanding of the psychology and subtleties of offline games (excitement, experience playing offline). It's hard for me to say who is better. It all depends on the situation and the players.

Online gives you much more action for the same time played so you learn faster (if you want to learn). Also online it is much more easier (and cheaper) to start playing which means that even at the low stakes you have enough good players and you need to learn and improve to be competitive. Maybe due to this they say that when you are successful online you also should be online. First time when i played in casino i was worried if i will be able to properly monitor blind levels, pot size and my own bets but it turned out to be much easier than i thought. Information about the blind levels and number of players was constantly available on several monitors and dealer took care of most of the other work. In fact playing in casino proved to be easier than a home game.

Originally Posted by scubed

I think the online player has a lot of tools that the live player doesn't. For example, how well does the online player do the following things live?

• Keep up with the pot. Most online card rooms display the pot size in the User Interface directly on the table. Can an online player keep up with the pot in a live game?
• Bet sizing math. Online card rooms make it easy to bet 1/2 pot, 1/3 pot, 3/4 pot etc. Will the online player have the skills to perform the math live?
• Pay attention to player tendencies. Can an online player operate without a HUD? What are the HUD stats that help him online? How does he intend to keep track of live players in order to make player tendency decisions?
• Stay focused when getting ~25 hands per hour. Most online players multi-table, can they adjust to the perceived slow pace of the live game

There are a ton more things I can think of. I am also, like you, curious.

Exactly. I wish I could give your post more likes. I don't play online yet, bu I would suspect the opposite would be true. During live play, you don't have all the numbers clearly displayed in front of you. You actually have to remember how often each player enters the pot, 3-bets, check-raises, etc. I would also think that an online player would be more likely to get impatient. Those bad card runs seem like forever when you are playing live ! Also, keeping track of your stack and other players's stack is much harder than you think. In my first few live tournaments, I made quite a few mistakes because I either didn't realize how short my stack was or I misjudged the size of other players' stacks. Granted, I do think there is a benefit to playing online. You get to see so many more hands that a lot of the more common situations get firmly ingrained in your head. That could certainly help your play.

I think there are big differences between online and live to suppose that but I think that online players are more aggressive when they play live games

I'm not sure either one has an advantage. I think with the online player he has more experience due to playing more hands. Live poker players know more about tells and the psychology of the game.

Of course they have. By playing it every day, it's the best exercise.

I personally do way better live than online. Not sure why really, never thought about it. But I guess because I can get reads on people. I also find that the cards play better, not as many bad beats etc.

The habit of consistently grinding multi-tables online and taking notes everywhere. This is something that translates well into live play, where the hands/hr is a lot lower but dynamic is no less interesting.

So yes, online grinders do have advantage because they are exposed to a lot more situations in a shorter period of time. The quick decision-making involved there makes playing live seem easier. Just not in an auto-pilot way.

Doug Polks upswing poker had this to say.


https://upswingpoker.com/online-poke...b114022b1ec50d

Use online poker with all the software add ons to practice and study for live play.
"play a game that's 5% to 10% of the stakes of your typical live game."

I personally think that any amount of play be it online or live can make for a better player.... practice makes perfect...lol

Yes. if they are good online players. a bad player is a bad player regardless of format. A good online player has so much experience, it definitely helps at the slower live game.

What scubed said I totally agree with , although I lack of the experience of a live game grinder , I can see many differences between the 2 kind of games .

There are players good at both of them , but I believe there are too many players who cannot adapt their style , strategy , technique , know-how , from live poker in casinos to online poker rooms and vice versa .

Is this a coincidence ? I do believe no , HUDs cult maybe contribute in this irregularity , other training/analysing tools , for online live games or postgame use , all accepted by most pokerrooms ---- bad for poker , my opinion ......

I know I talked and saw professional players who can play both in online poker and in live events, but they say that it is easier for them to play online poker if you compare the game in tournaments, the main thing they say is to
any card played well and it will depend on you how and in which position you will play it,
I also asked them how to play online against live poker for them, told me that they could play here and there, and I even watched a player win a ticket through satellites and then play in a live tournament and win money!