Interesting Spot Pt. 2

[Minikiwi9]

https://www.cardschat.com/replayer/9qg9eXk

Here is an interesting spot, when I Min open and get a BB defend. I felt like this hand as played was okay (I know its fine to give up sometimes), though I know there could have been many other options to play it differently and likely more optimally.

I'll happily explain what I was thinking, but for some background this is a 3.25 9man Turbo - V at the time was a 48 13 (VPIP, PFR) with only 34 hands of data. Unlikely he connected with the flop , possibly/likely I got floated with Highcards? I'll leave the analysis to anyone who wants to take a look, if you have questions for me let me know I will be happy to think through them, but would love to hear this hand from other angles. Thanks!!

 

[eetenor]

https://www.cardschat.com/replayer/9qg9eXk

Here is an interesting spot, when I Min open and get a BB defend. I felt like this hand as played was okay (I know its fine to give up sometimes), though I know there could have been many other options to play it differently and likely more optimally.

I'll happily explain what I was thinking, but for some background this is a 3.25 9man Turbo - V at the time was a 48 13 (VPIP, PFR) with only 34 hands of data. Unlikely he connected with the flop , possibly/likely I got floated with Highcards? I'll leave the analysis to anyone who wants to take a look, if you have questions for me let me know I will be happy to think through them, but would love to hear this hand from other angles. Thanks!!

Thank U 4 Posting

Ok here are some questions for you. As you said there are many ways to think about this.


We have 14BB to start the hand.

Villain has loose passive stats, could we shove here preflop?
Could we just fold? Knowing that villain was in the BB?
Can we bet larger preflop?
Can we adjust our betting vs our player pool to an unbalanced strategy?
Should we be staying balanced but increasing our open sizes vs this player pool?
Can we adjust our bet sizing vs this one villain?
Are you aware of the reasoning behind the 2bb preflop raise?
Does that reasoning apply to your player pool?

As played

Villain has loose passive stats- when we bet flop what should be our plan on turn vs that type of villain? Does our stack size allow us to 2 barrel? Are you comfortable shoving turn and losing? Would this villain fold A3 on turn? Is A3 part of the BB flat range pre- call not check raise flop?
What sizing would we use on that board with AA-55 22? Should we stay balanced?

Can we use a delayed c-bet strategy?
Does the Q help or hurt that plan?
Does the 250 we bet on flop not have more leverage as a bet on turn when checked to?

Can we not check flop- fold turn vs a lead from a villain with these stats?
A3 A5 A2 is still ahead even if V thinks a lead is a bluff.

Can we have a stronger turn bluff shove if V leads out small?
Would you be comfortable taking that action?

Do we think that this V will try to run us over if we raise pre -fold post in this spot?
Can they, when we have 12BB in a SNG?
Can anyone else on the table?
So exploitable play is valuable if the answers to the above are No.


A good exercise would be for you to type out a range that you think V would play like this in this spot, the way it was played. Then estimate how much of that range you could get to fold out using each of the strategies: Your strategy, adjusting bet sizing pre- bet timing post and shoving pre and post. If it is not the correct percentage check folding could be the best approach with this stack size

Hope this helps

 

[Minikiwi9]

Thanks for replying, I'll reply in-depth tomorrow.

I appreciate you looking in depth on a hand like this, I also found today the proper place to post these so I'll be doing that correctly now l0l

Thank U 4 Posting

Ok here are some questions for you. As you said there are many ways to think about this.


We have 14BB to start the hand.

Villain has loose passive stats, could we shove here preflop?
Could we just fold? Knowing that villain was in the BB?
Can we bet larger preflop?
Can we adjust our betting vs our player pool to an unbalanced strategy?
Should we be staying balanced but increasing our open sizes vs this player pool?
Can we adjust our bet sizing vs this one villain?
Are you aware of the reasoning behind the 2bb preflop raise?
Does that reasoning apply to your player pool?

As played

Villain has loose passive stats- when we bet flop what should be our plan on turn vs that type of villain? Does our stack size allow us to 2 barrel? Are you comfortable shoving turn and losing? Would this villain fold A3 on turn? Is A3 part of the BB flat range pre- call not check raise flop?
What sizing would we use on that board with AA-55 22? Should we stay balanced?

Can we use a delayed c-bet strategy?
Does the Q help or hurt that plan?
Does the 250 we bet on flop not have more leverage as a bet on turn when checked to?

Can we not check flop- fold turn vs a lead from a villain with these stats?
A3 A5 A2 is still ahead even if V thinks a lead is a bluff.

Can we have a stronger turn bluff shove if V leads out small?
Would you be comfortable taking that action?

Do we think that this V will try to run us over if we raise pre -fold post in this spot?
Can they, when we have 12BB in a SNG?
Can anyone else on the table?
So exploitable play is valuable if the answers to the above are No.


A good exercise would be for you to type out a range that you think V would play like this in this spot, the way it was played. Then estimate how much of that range you could get to fold out using each of the strategies: Your strategy, adjusting bet sizing pre- bet timing post and shoving pre and post. If it is not the correct percentage check folding could be the best approach with this stack size

Hope this helps

 

[Collin Moshman]

Your line is good. Shoving or min-raising pre-flop are both very reasonable.

My biggest suggestion is to c-bet with smaller sizing on this dry flop. Typically you want to c-bet around 33% of pot on very dry flops. That would allow you to barrel this turn scare card and get him to fold a lot of hands like ace-high and Js8s (double overs and backdoor flush).

 

[Minikiwi9]

Shoving Preflop makes sense and makes money, I don't think there is a doubt about it. Personally I haven't experienced with many other raise sizes other than min betting, especially with no antes and enough other tables to manage. Though I do believe raising more than min do scare some players in fear of not getting a good enough price and folding out more than they should. My thought with the Cbet is get Highcards/Air to fold. Given the board texture here it is likely I failed to do so. Which correctly so he floated.
I have found that Cbetting is usually a sound idea, and I'm positive arguments for the most optimal line cbetting here could be correct. Though I do know checking back some boards, especially dry ones, in some cases is correct to do, because V should know if I'm Cbetting here I likely have Ahigh at best (occasionally PP) but X/R me would be a very sound thing to do.

If he checks turn, then I would have a clear Cbet and likely take it down which is a very sound play in my mind and feel as though I missed an opportunity there

As played I don't feel like Jamming turn as a bluff would be a bad play, unless he did spike the Q he will give.

It been fun to analyze some spots in depth on here the battle goes on:fight:
I'm def going be looking for a couple more spots to post on here, I've been going through a lot of spots it has been a lot of fun.
Thanks guys