How to prevent losing your entire bankroll?

V

VedySneakyYT

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I have played about with a little over 100$ in total on ACR then won/lost around 900$.I've added 200-225$ on ignition and again, around 900$ won and lost. Then switching, I added 70$ on GlobalPoker. For some reason, every single time I play on ignition, I have someone jump onto a table, bet HUGE and go all-in by the turn then hit some ungodly hand and bounce out. On Americas cardroom, I had a bit more luck with sit and go/mtt but I still could not get a good enough balance to keep from putting 10% or more of my bankroll at the micro tables. Recently though on global, I have taken 70$ and brought it up to 225$ with a couple mtt freerolls and cash games but since winning big (for me) on Saturday, I am on a major downswing. I am getting so many bad beats/coolers that I'm starting to wonder if it is even worth playing anymore.

How does one control themselves when on a downswing and prevent losing their entire bankroll like I have over the last 2 days? Yes, 2 days is all it took for me to lose the 225$ due to thinking, "I can move up from .02/.04 and .05/.1 to .10/.20 and .25/.50". At what point would you recommend moving up? I have been watching previous gameplay. I'm noticing that once I took some pros advice and tightened up then started squeezing when I make a hand, 15/17 hands end up being the second best set/full house/quads. Hiring a coach may be next on my list but I have to figure out how to say "Stop" once I've lost a certain amount.
 
H

Heresthecooler

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I have this problem, too. My thing is, I have an amount that I will quit at. If I don't hit it, I'll continue playing. Sometimes it requires losing all of your money, in order to quit playing poker, for some time. I'm almost 100% sure that players who consistently lose, have never cashed out. Ever. Cashing out and physically having money in your hand, will allow you to have more control. Honestly, I haven't cash out since the days of poker stars. That was about 16 years ago.
 
E

E V A N

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I hear you guys,

In theory I’m the most disciplined player in the world. Then once I hit the tables and suffer a bad beat it’s bye bye bankroll 😭

There’s something to not just having a plan but being able to STICK TO IT in mentally stressful situations
 
E

eetenor

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100 buy-ins

I have played about with a little over 100$ in total on ACR then won/lost around 900$.I've added 200-225$ on ignition and again, around 900$ won and lost. Then switching, I added 70$ on GlobalPoker. For some reason, every single time I play on ignition, I have someone jump onto a table, bet HUGE and go all-in by the turn then hit some ungodly hand and bounce out. On Americas cardroom, I had a bit more luck with sit and go/mtt but I still could not get a good enough balance to keep from putting 10% or more of my bankroll at the micro tables. Recently though on global, I have taken 70$ and brought it up to 225$ with a couple mtt freerolls and cash games but since winning big (for me) on Saturday, I am on a major downswing. I am getting so many bad beats/coolers that I'm starting to wonder if it is even worth playing anymore.

How does one control themselves when on a downswing and prevent losing their entire bankroll like I have over the last 2 days? Yes, 2 days is all it took for me to lose the 225$ due to thinking, "I can move up from .02/.04 and .05/.1 to .10/.20 and .25/.50". At what point would you recommend moving up? I have been watching previous gameplay. I'm noticing that once I took some pros advice and tightened up then started squeezing when I make a hand, 15/17 hands end up being the second best set/full house/quads. Hiring a coach may be next on my list but I have to figure out how to say "Stop" once I've lost a certain amount.

Thank u 4 Posting

A bankroll of 100 buy-ins is recommended. For the very reason of the swings amateur players have.

So If you are playing 2NL $200 is needed.

If you build your bankroll to $225 and move up to 4NL $400 is needed you are $175 short.

Moving up and losing kills the bankroll. If we have a 10 buy-in down swing at 4NL that is $40 we are now short on our 2NL roll. That is a nothing swing. You can do that in a day online and never even make a mistake. Add in mistakes look out.
We need to take shots at higher levels but stay in the game we win in until we have the bankroll for the higher stakes.

Hope this helps

:):)
 
AgentXtreme

AgentXtreme

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Basic bankroll management is good and reasonable like 100 buy ins you can even go lower 70-80.
 
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neafana

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Maybe you have wrong bankroll management. At the lowest stakes, until 10NL you can have also 60 buy ins. From then you will need to have between 60 and 100 buy ins. It depends on your skill. You have to realize when you are on a downswing decrease your stakes. If you don't do it you will go broke every time. It's hard to play for example on 25NL and then decrease to stakes to 5NL.
 
shane4050

shane4050

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Thank u 4 Posting

A bankroll of 100 buy-ins is recommended. For the very reason of the swings amateur players have.

So If you are playing 2NL $200 is needed.

If you build your bankroll to $225 and move up to 4NL $400 is needed you are $175 short.

Moving up and losing kills the bankroll. If we have a 10 buy-in down swing at 4NL that is $40 we are now short on our 2NL roll. That is a nothing swing. You can do that in a day online and never even make a mistake. Add in mistakes look out.
We need to take shots at higher levels but stay in the game we win in until we have the bankroll for the higher stakes.

Hope this helps

:):)

This is excellent advice! that and you can also set a loss limit on most clients if you find yourself losing control.
 
R

Richard Grant

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Thank u 4 Posting

A bankroll of 100 buy-ins is recommended. For the very reason of the swings amateur players have.

So If you are playing 2NL $200 is needed.

If you build your bankroll to $225 and move up to 4NL $400 is needed you are $175 short.

Moving up and losing kills the bankroll. If we have a 10 buy-in down swing at 4NL that is $40 we are now short on our 2NL roll. That is a nothing swing. You can do that in a day online and never even make a mistake. Add in mistakes look out.
We need to take shots at higher levels but stay in the game we win in until we have the bankroll for the higher stakes.

Hope this helps

:):)

What can a high performing reg expect as worst case scenario downswings? I was under the impression somebody of that level would not see 10 buy-in downswings?
 
shane4050

shane4050

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What can a high performing reg expect as worst case scenario downswings? I was under the impression somebody of that level would not see 10 buy-in downswings?

Variance of online poker is alot higher, even playing live a 10 buy in downswing is not uncommon. I personally can sit down and lose 5 buy in a cash game no problem then break even or +ev within afew hands because low stakes online really comes to push fold until you get to know your players at the table by using huds and notes etc. Everything has a pattern and until then you can assume everyone is playing bingo which is where alot of your bad beats will come from. Plus its hard to push an aggressive reg off a hand that is +ev most times for them at such low stakes as they are usually bankrolled alot higher/assume you will fold and are basing most information just off your hud stats . To answer your question i would say best case scenario downswing is you slowly lose your roll but it doesn't effect your mindset as your playing at a stake that doesn't effect you financially and you gain lots of skill and have fun. Worst case "Ontario" you have to turn to stripping to pay bills.
 
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eetenor

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What can a high performing reg expect as worst case scenario downswings? I was under the impression somebody of that level would not see 10 buy-in downswings?


Thank U 4 Responding.

Two questions.

What do you consider a worst case scenario downswing in this scenario?

The reason one recommends 100 Buy-ins is because worst case scenario for very good pros has been as much as 60 Buy-ins.
Again not often but possible.
Google Bryan Devonshire downswing. His card player article is informative.

Hope this helps

:pcguru:
 
LJG23

LJG23

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I am not a cash game player, but I am a stickler for BR management. I avoid cash games for that reason. A downswing in cash hits the bankroll way harder than MTTs. The easiest answer to you question is your moving up to fast. At your current bankroll you have enough to play the micros comfortable and take the hits of a downswing and not go broke. If your crushing a level CRUSH it pad your bankroll and take selective shots but if you get your hand smacked don't be afraid to move down and start crushing again. Will keep your confidence up and you'll have hopefully learned why you got your hand smacked.

The second thing I want to point out is the extreme difference in playing .02/.04 and .25/.50 online. There are fish everywhere at the micros but as soon as you move up to "mid" stakes that is where sharks fest. Take small shots when you move up get comfortable with the play and most importantly protect your bankroll!!!
I have played about with a little over 100$ in total on ACR then won/lost around 900$.I've added 200-225$ on ignition and again, around 900$ won and lost. Then switching, I added 70$ on GlobalPoker. For some reason, every single time I play on ignition, I have someone jump onto a table, bet HUGE and go all-in by the turn then hit some ungodly hand and bounce out. On Americas cardroom, I had a bit more luck with sit and go/mtt but I still could not get a good enough balance to keep from putting 10% or more of my bankroll at the micro tables. Recently though on global, I have taken 70$ and brought it up to 225$ with a couple mtt freerolls and cash games but since winning big (for me) on Saturday, I am on a major downswing. I am getting so many bad beats/coolers that I'm starting to wonder if it is even worth playing anymore.

How does one control themselves when on a downswing and prevent losing their entire bankroll like I have over the last 2 days? Yes, 2 days is all it took for me to lose the 225$ due to thinking, "I can move up from .02/.04 and .05/.1 to .10/.20 and .25/.50". At what point would you recommend moving up? I have been watching previous gameplay. I'm noticing that once I took some pros advice and tightened up then started squeezing when I make a hand, 15/17 hands end up being the second best set/full house/quads. Hiring a coach may be next on my list but I have to figure out how to say "Stop" once I've lost a certain amount.
 
R

Richard Grant

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Thank U 4 Responding.

Two questions.

What do you consider a worst case scenario downswing in this scenario?

The reason one recommends 100 Buy-ins is because worst case scenario for very good pros has been as much as 60 Buy-ins.
Again not often but possible.
Google Bryan Devonshire downswing. His card player article is informative.

Hope this helps

:pcguru:

Interesting. I assumed strong players had enough of an edge that it wouldn't get that bad. Micro LAGS I assumed were bashing the tables up to such an extent, bleeding lots of exploitable leaks, that when variance came into play they would effectively already be covering a lot of losses.

I'd have thought players who know the game inside out could start with 10 buy ins, then grind, only going up levels when they have built up a stack that covers ten buy ins at that level.

To what extent is Devonshire got a good edge on the tables he played? I'll have a look at what he says.
 
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DAVID KEHRER

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I might be wrong but i dont play any cash games till i have 200x the ante. I stay with small mtt and sit-n-goes money seems to last longer for me.
 
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dompoker

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To avoid losing all your bankroll, you should not play outside bench, to play tournaments you must have at least 100 buy ins.
 
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fundiver199

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As others have said, the way to avoid going broke in poker is to use some form of bankroll management. However that being said a recreational online player does not need 100 x the buyin to play micro stakes cash games. That level of buffer is for professional players, who depend on poker for their living.

For the rest of us moving down is an option, if we hit a downswing, so its more a question of having the discipline to actually do that, and certainly not move up to "win it back". And should we lose the last at 2NL, well then redeposit is also an option. Its not like, its the end of the world, if we talk about popping for instance 50$ into the account.

I would recommend 30x the buyin as a reasonable bankroll management rule in the micros, which give the following guideline for, which limit to play using the 888 poker limits as an example:

<150$ - 2NL
150-300$ - 5NL
300-600$ - 10NL
600-900$ - 20NL
900-1.500$ - 30NL
1.500-3.000$ - 50NL

Note that while the minimum is 30BI, a lot of the time we are actually playing with way more, so this is already fairly conservative. If you dont mind some larger swings, its also reasonable to use a "shot taking" system, where anything above 30BI for your current limit can be used for "shots" at the next.

If for instance you have 80$, that is 30BI for 2NL + 4BI for a "shot" at 5NL. And this is fine, as long as you respect the system and move back to 2NL, if the "shot" fail. If you can not survive at 2NL with 60$, then chances are, you are not even a winning player, and then no amount of bankroll management will protect you from eventually having to reload.
 
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Dondi_kz

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To quickly not to lose your bonus in the initial stage.

What minimum bankroll and what limits to play to increase your bankroll at the initial stage. I've been playing for a few years, but I did not manage to increase your bankroll, that I win, I lose the other games.
 
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nuttea

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Control the tilt. Tilt is the No. 1 bankroll killer in the world. Usually caused by a violation of one of the previous rules, or by something like a bedbit. Tilt is able to bring even the most balanced player to frenzy, unreasonable bets, raises and calls. The causes of tilt are individual and can come from anywhere. Although the intensity of tilt varies from one person to another, it is impossible to completely get rid of it.
 
kley126

kley126

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I would personally recommend that you take some time to rest from the tables, relax, study a bit and analyze where you are making the mistake or mistakes when you are playing, you should also control your temper, losing and entering with more to recover will lead you to have great losses if don't correct your failures
 
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Dimitris

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To OP
If you want to get better at poker or play more seriously you must hire a coach.
If you want to play for fun put a stop loss at 3 BI. Post some hands at the forum and read some books.
Just my 2 cents.
 
JJP

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Best way to keep your bank roll is to learn to play within it ! Whatever games you want to play wether cash or MTTs should be within your set limits

Some decent standards are 25-30 buyins for cash games and 100 buyins for mtts. Then adjust accordingly to how much is in your BR ! Good Luck :)
 
Gringo5521

Gringo5521

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I have played about with a little over 100$ in total on ACR then won/lost around 900$.I've added 200-225$ on ignition and again, around 900$ won and lost. Then switching, I added 70$ on GlobalPoker. For some reason, every single time I play on ignition, I have someone jump onto a table, bet HUGE and go all-in by the turn then hit some ungodly hand and bounce out. On Americas cardroom, I had a bit more luck with sit and go/mtt but I still could not get a good enough balance to keep from putting 10% or more of my bankroll at the micro tables. Recently though on global, I have taken 70$ and brought it up to 225$ with a couple mtt freerolls and cash games but since winning big (for me) on Saturday, I am on a major downswing. I am getting so many bad beats/coolers that I'm starting to wonder if it is even worth playing anymore.

How does one control themselves when on a downswing and prevent losing their entire bankroll like I have over the last 2 days? Yes, 2 days is all it took for me to lose the 225$ due to thinking, "I can move up from .02/.04 and .05/.1 to .10/.20 and .25/.50". At what point would you recommend moving up? I have been watching previous gameplay. I'm noticing that once I took some pros advice and tightened up then started squeezing when I make a hand, 15/17 hands end up being the second best set/full house/quads. Hiring a coach may be next on my list but I have to figure out how to say "Stop" once I've lost a certain amount.


I think you just have to diversify your leisure time.
I mean, look for more hobbies for yourself besides poker.
If you sometimes do something else, it will increase interest in every poker game. In the end, it will increase your result. But this is only my personal opinion.
 
BlackJesus

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It is easier if you have proper bankroll management (BRM) in the first place! :)
(My assumption of you having wrong BRM might be wrong and I apologize if that is the case. However, the problem you are talking about is very tempting if a player has wrong BRM. Then, let's say he has 10-20 buy-ins and loses 5. It is quite tempting to raise the stakes in attempt to recover the notable losses. But if you have 50 buy-ins, the temptation is much weaker. So... Perhaps 1 advice is to play proper stakes and have proper BRM! )
 
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chuckycheese

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I have played about with a little over 100$ in total on ACR then won/lost around 900$.I've added 200-225$ on ignition and again, around 900$ won and lost. Then switching, I added 70$ on GlobalPoker. For some reason, every single time I play on ignition, I have someone jump onto a table, bet HUGE and go all-in by the turn then hit some ungodly hand and bounce out. On Americas cardroom, I had a bit more luck with sit and go/mtt but I still could not get a good enough balance to keep from putting 10% or more of my bankroll at the micro tables. Recently though on global, I have taken 70$ and brought it up to 225$ with a couple mtt freerolls and cash games but since winning big (for me) on Saturday, I am on a major downswing. I am getting so many bad beats/coolers that I'm starting to wonder if it is even worth playing anymore.

How does one control themselves when on a downswing and prevent losing their entire bankroll like I have over the last 2 days? Yes, 2 days is all it took for me to lose the 225$ due to thinking, "I can move up from .02/.04 and .05/.1 to .10/.20 and .25/.50". At what point would you recommend moving up? I have been watching previous gameplay. I'm noticing that once I took some pros advice and tightened up then started squeezing when I make a hand, 15/17 hands end up being the second best set/full house/quads. Hiring a coach may be next on my list but I have to figure out how to say "Stop" once I've lost a certain amount.
thats good that you have that kind of willpower, but it doesn not matter what limit it is, you will all ways have bad beats. knowing when to quit is great, i wish i could.
 
Nathan Williams

Nathan Williams

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I have never gone broke in 10+ years mostly playing as a pro. Bankroll management is the key to never losing your bankroll.

You need to set clear rules for what bankroll is needed for each limit and then you move up or move down accordingly.

For me, I often play with as much as 100 buyins per cash game limit. This ensures that there is no chance I ever lose my whole bankroll, no matter how bad a downswing I go through.
 
JJP

JJP

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By using bankroll management correctly. A good rule of thumb for me has always been, 100 buyins for MTTs and 25 buyins for cash games then adjust accordingly.

I have used this strat to much success over the years, depositing very rarely.
 
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