Do you like to use the Donk Bet or is it not in your betting repertoire?

Jim Rivas

Jim Rivas

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Some players use this type of bet a lot, I do not like to steal initiatives on flops, and you?
 
najisami

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Honestly, I only have used that kind of bet very rarely. I actually prefer the check/raise to that when I have a reason to make me do it. Besides, the donk bet often generates a raise or even a shove...
 
Shufflin

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I find it can be effective as a bluff if I've called from the blinds and the flop is low cards
 
black and

black and

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I only play with good cards. Playing with junk is not my style.
 
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Mahdi

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sometimes if there is many people in the pot I use it, but usually I try to avoid it
 
Phoenix Wright

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I feel like "Donk Bet" has negative connotations connected to a fish believing they are betting for value when they are in fact behind. By this logic, donk betting should be avoided as well as being a donkey player...

with that said, this "play" could be useful in specific circumstances, but I wouldn't call this a "donk bet" - I'd call it:

-Taking the betting lead from an opponent

-bluffing to force them off of a marginal hand

-Floating (if on Turn or River after calling the Flop like we call the Flop bet and then they bet the Turn and we "donk?" raise over them)

It might sound picky to terminology, but I think this play has merit in a few spots, but "donk" anything should be avoided by good players :)
 
MoCoSolo

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Might need to define the "Donk Bet" because just by calling it that, using it makes you a Donk, even for one play. Playing aggressively is fine, playing like a donk has no value.
 
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BatOneHat

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Almost Never

Almost never use that strategy. Almost never see it work.
 
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fundiver199

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First of all what is a donk bet? I go with the definition, which is stated on Wikipedia, which is simply "a lead into the previous street aggressor". The name "donk bet" is obviously derogatory, since "donk" is slang for a bad poker player. People have different understandings off, what exactly a "donk" is, but its definitely not someone, who is very good, and its probably also someone, who is aggressive in a bad way. And leading into the person, who had the initiative on the previous street, is definitely aggressive, so the name is kind of fitting.

However donk betting is not always bad. Solvers have told us a lot about GTO strategies, and solvers do actually donk bet in some situations on both the flop, turn and river. So if we NEVER do that, then we are probably actually the real "donk". Its a complicated topic, but in general donk betting makes sense on turn and river cards, that change the texture. For instance if you called on the flop with top pair good kicker and improve to trips, you might want to lead (donk) the turn to not allow the opponent to check back overpairs and draws.

On the flop good spots to donk bet are more rare, but they do still come up. I am typically not doing it in a very balanced way to be honest. But if for instance I flop a set in a multiway pot, and the SPR is like 4-5, I will typically just lead out. I can easily get all the chips in by betting 3 streets, so I dont need to go for a check-raise to build the pot.

Its also kind of unlikely, the preflop raiser will C-bet light in a multiway pot, and I dont want the flop to get checked through allowing all sorts of gutshots and backdoor draws to develop their equity for free. So in that situation I will be like "hey guys I like this flop", and then its up to them to figure out, just how strong I hit it :)
 
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fundiver199

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On the flip side what are the reasons to not donk bet, and how do we exploit people, who do it to much? If we take the main situation, which is the flop, then typically most players will split their range when defending their blinds. They will fold the worst hands, 3-bet the best hands and call with middling strenght hands, that are getting a good price, especially when in the big blind. For that reason the preflop raiser will usually have a range advantage. He will have all the overpairs, he will have TPTK on A or K high boards, he will have big sets, and so on and so forth.

If big blind in such a situation lead with all his best hands on the flop, that will leave him with a very weak checking range, that cant defend properly against aggression. He will either need to call down with a lot of garbage, that is likely to lose at showdown, or he will end up folding to much. So if we notice, that someone loves to donk bet the flop, then we should get pretty aggressive against them, when they just check.

A HUD is a very usefull tool here, if its allowed. If they fold to much to C-bets, we should do a lot of one-and-done C-betting. Could even be with our entire range, if C-bets are outright profitable. If they both do a lot of donk betting, and also dont give up to flop C-bets, then per definition they are calling our flop bet with tons of garbage. So we should look to continue our aggression a lot on turns and rivers, both with bluffs and light valuebets.
 
Jim Rivas

Jim Rivas

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Honestly, I only have used that kind of bet very rarely. I actually prefer the check/raise to that when I have a reason to make me do it. Besides, the donk bet often generates a raise or even a shove...


I prefer the check/raise too, so I protect my check range and don´t give me a Raise every time that I check.:D
 
Jim Rivas

Jim Rivas

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I find it can be effective as a bluff if I've called from the blinds and the flop is low cards
That is a good reason to do, especially if you have a good read of opponent range and the flop type..:rolleyes:
 
Jim Rivas

Jim Rivas

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sometimes if there is many people in the pot I use it, but usually I try to avoid it
It´s strange, if there is many people in the pot, I think that is loose. I would prefer to do face up.:smile:
 
Jim Rivas

Jim Rivas

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I feel like "Donk Bet" has negative connotations connected to a fish believing they are betting for value when they are in fact behind. By this logic, donk betting should be avoided as well as being a donkey player...

with that said, this "play" could be useful in specific circumstances, but I wouldn't call this a "donk bet" - I'd call it:

-Taking the betting lead from an opponent

-Bluffing to force them off of a marginal hand

-Floating (if on Turn or River after calling the Flop like we call the Flop bet and then they bet the Turn and we "donk?" raise over them)

It might sound picky to terminology, but I think this play has merit in a few spots, but "donk" anything should be avoided by good players :)


First person that tell me the motives to use or not Donk BET, thank you!:D
 
Vlaad

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I don't do it often, however I like to donk bet when I face an opponent who rarely c-bets.
 
Jim Rivas

Jim Rivas

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Might need to define the "Donk Bet" because just by calling it that, using it makes you a Donk, even for one play. Playing aggressively is fine, playing like a donk has no value.



I don't like that define a bet with a ridiculous name (Donker, limper,....) to justify that is the worst player of world. I only use and see four action buttons: Raise, Call, check, Fold. I don't see buttons : Limp, donk, bluff.:jd4:
 
Evan Jarvis

Evan Jarvis

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Some players use this type of bet a lot, I do not like to steal initiatives on flops, and you?


Indeed it's not the most common strategy but one that has value nonethless

In deep stack situations as other poster have mentioned in this thread

GTO likes leading out from the big blinds when the flop is all low cards

why?

The raiser rarely if ever has these cards in their hand and thus other than the rare set they won't be able to take much heat on these flops.

If you're holding even a pair and a gutshot it gives you a way to control the growth of the pot, price yourself in, and not get blown off your hand. (A thinking opponent will not be able to raise your bets because it's possible you actually hold the nuts).


This was also common to do in spots where you want to check-raise, but you don't expect your opponents to make a continuation bet on that particular board texture. It's a good way to ensure money goes in the pot when you had either a strong hand (which could become second best on bad turns), or a strong draw (which would lose a lot of equity if the turn is a brick)


Leading out on turns that favor you but dont favor your opponent is also a nice strategy to mix in. It puts opponents on the defensive and prevents them from pot controlling, or just controlling the action in general.

Again, these situations won't come up very often, but when they do it's worth making the play

Examples are when the middle or bottom card pairs on a board where you can have 2nd or 3rd pair but your opponents range is mostly weighted towards top pair, better, and bluffs



Finally, against opponents who just hate donk bets, and feel the need to raise them whenever they see them... well... this is a good way to get some extra money in the middle against them


I like being willing to do some leading (the other name for donkbetting) because it keeps me open to all possibilities and doesn't get me stuck in a limited way of playing hands
 
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Cinhos_2000

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I really rarely do it. The case I most often do this is when I'm really short stacked and don't want the risk of the villain checking and getting a free card, in those cases I donk bet all in.
 
sharipov8090

sharipov8090

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I try to play on the card I haven't learned how to bluff yet and the donk itself is a test of whether the opponent has a match on the flop.
 
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Mahdi

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It´s strange, if there is many people in the pot, I think that is loose. I would prefer to do face up.:smile:

I do it to protect my hand if I hit, to avoid giving free card in case it checked to multiple opponent
 
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hyfl

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Very rarely, mostly against tight/aggressive players that are playing ABC poker.
 
A

alien666dj

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Any type of betting is necessary only under certain conditions.
 
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jj6m

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if im feeling in a bullish mood i would
 
Vilgeoforc

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I think this is a good play in a heads-up game to stalemate the opponent. But in a 6-max game, it's also a good move to provoke with a strong hand, or vice versa for a bluff against tight players.
 
ChickenArise

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Where ever you feel the desire to donk, ask yourself would a check raise be more effective. If the answer is no, a donk is fine.
 
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