What prevents people from cheating?

Pimp 007 x

Pimp 007 x

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I know I may sound a bit paranoid, but this has been a matter that I sometimes think about, and there's probably nothing anyone can do about. I'm not talking about bots, but about people who team up to have a better advantage over other players.

What prevents people from teaming up?

For example, say 100 people enter the same tournament. These people know each other and share their hands to have a better probabilty of winning. Now, these people don't have to be in the same room, they could probably be living in different countries and continents, but have a way to communicate with each other, so, there's no reason for any room to speculate that they're cheating and has no incentive to not put them togheter in the same table.

Now imagine having two of these people in the same table? Knowing each other hands, rasing and reraising to control the action. Now imagine 3 people in the same table... Now more than 4... Imagine being in a table full of people who know each other's cards against you!

Again, I may seem paranoid, but this can be perfectly doable if people are simply willing to cheat... once, in pokerstars, I was about to register to a 20 dollar SnG, once I saw who was also registered, I quickly unregistered as fast as I could . There were at least 15 people already registered, all from Greece, now I have nothing against people from this place, but it's too much of a coincidence to not be taken into consideration... Again it might just be my paranoic self acting up... ? This is actually the reason why I'm making this topic...

This is definitely the worst aspect about online poker, there is simply no way to know who is behind the other cards.

What do you guys think? Can this happen? Is this happening as we speak? Can we do anything about it? Post your theorys and anectodes.
 
puzzlefish

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Absolutely it is happening. Colluders have and will be investigated and banned before and again. It's probably even more rampant in public freerolls where a site won't be paying as much attention, so cheaters flood the freerolls with accounts and chip dump to one another with their garbage hands. Where there is an edge to be leveraged, know that there are people trying or who have already succeeded in leveraging it.
 
MikeCarasone

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Unfortunately money makes people do horrible things. It’s definitely happening IMO. That’s why being paranoid may be a good thing. The players have to be vigilant and police the games themselves. When someone sees something that looks fishy they need to let support or a tournament director or the floor know. The poker world is full of degenerates and unscrupulous people. They will cheat, steal, lie, and manipulate in order to get what they want. I’m not saying all players are doing wrong, I believe most are playing on the level, but there’s obviously a select few that violate the rules to gain an edge. Many players have been caught botting, teaming up, multi accounting, and sharing hole cards. There’s many professional players that have been caught, yet the poker world seems to overlook some. It always amazes me when I hear story after story of players scamming money from others. Not honoring loans. Ripping off backers. Intentionally dumping. Selling multiple pieces that end up never being paid. There are “black lists” pages on Facebook that have numerous names of untrustworthy players. They join clubs make a transfer or deposit, then they reverse it once they lose or dump funds to another. Makes me wonder if poker Apps are safe. It really is sad. Hard to imagine how some of these people can look themselves in the mirror. Yet they seem to have no problem showing up at tournament after tournament, year after year. I’m happy to see some of the online sites being more proactive in cleaning up the games. It’s a start. If everyone is aware, and watching out for cheaters , hopefully we can prevent some of these things from happening. When you see 15 players from Greece in a SnG it’s smart to have some type of feeling that something may be happening that shouldn’t be. I would hope the sites would have programs that can spot this obvious behavior, but if not there’s nothing wrong with asking the site to investigate. It may be a coincidence, if so then nothing needs to be done. If it is a team then I gotta believe the site will drop the ban hammer, or I would hope so.
 
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It would be much easier and more likely on cash tables.
 
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cheeeer

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I never understod that. How will it help you? Even if you know all other cards at the table: 8 players*2 cards= 16 known cards. Yet 69% (or 60% on the river) unknown cards. Yes, it increases chances to know the hand but not much.
I remember I folded 10, flop opens with two 10s. German raises, all fold. I say: "I had 10". German says:"Me too". How will it help you to indentify he had THAT 1 out? Or that he didn't have?

I don't like more when big stacks try to squeeze small stack from the tourney. Once I was moved to another table with all big stacks. I had middle stack in compare to the whole tourny. They always raised me (4-10BB or more) and pushed me to go all-in, while when I fold they played check-check against each other. Raiser was absolutely different every hand. Of course, 1 out of 8 players always will have some decent hand against me. Yes, it's a game but....
 
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I never understod that. How will it help you? Even if you know all other cards at the table: 8 players*2 cards= 16 known cards. Yet 69% (or 60% on the river) unknown cards. Yes, it increases chances to know the hand but not much.
I remember I folded 10, flop opens with two 10s. German raises, all fold. I say: "I had 10". German says:"Me too". How will it help you to indentify he had THAT 1 out? Or that he didn't have?

I don't like more when big stacks try to squeeze small stack from the tourney. Once I was moved to another table with all big stacks. I had middle stack in compare to the whole tourny. They always raised me (4-10BB or more) and pushed me to go all-in, while when I fold they played check-check against each other. Raiser was absolutely different every hand. Of course, 1 out of 8 players always will have some decent hand against me. Yes, it's a game but....

lol seriously?
Ring Ring
Yes
I have pocket AA - flat my raise to get more players in the pot.
I have an open ended str draw - need any 9 or A - duse, I have a pair of 9s - you aint going make that draw.
 
puzzlefish

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Of course not.

Still two 9s and two A.
Are you seriously saying this? Do you know about the concept of blockers and their significance with the probability of certain outcomes on the board?
 
dedok0525

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In live poker, too, people come together. It is customary practice. During the bubble people agree that to play against one of his opponents that he had fewer chances in the hand. If one opponent calls him a better chance than if he calls the two.
 
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Are you seriously saying this?
Of course not.
Can't believe I need to write it again.

Are you seriously saying this? Do you know about the concept of blockers and their significance with the probability of certain outcomes on the board?
I thought I wrote it before.... Yes, it increases chances to know the hand but not much.
Can't believe I need to write it again.

But truly say, I did not understand his example.
 
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I'm assuming that it does happen, but sites often try and prevent such actions by not allowing accounts from the same IP address. Granted it wouldn't be too difficult to give off a false IP so I'm not sure how.
 
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Cheating

I have thought about this before and I think this would be more likely to happen in Cash games. In cash games people can easily join the same table and work together in order to take other peoples money. I swear I have seen this happen on ACR but I didn't have the guts to go out and say it.
 
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This version has the right to life.
 
Poker Orifice

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. It's probably even more rampant in public freerolls where a site won't be paying as much attention, so cheaters flood the freerolls with accounts and chip dump to one another with their garbage hands.


Hey I see how you 'figured that one out' :eek:

Hey good thinking(?)... I mean I can see why they'd put in their valuable time in those freerolls so that they can be getting a great hourly from them. They must be able to pull in an easy 46cents per hour... maybe... right??

You couldn't make up any stupider comments if you tried. Oh... I just realized something, you DID make this up.
 
0546474

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I know that PokerStars very closely monitor the players who too often sit at the same table and there are so many cases when they were accused of fraud and blocked access to the game !!! so I don't think anyone will be able to do this for a long time !!!!
 
puzzlefish

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Hey I see how you 'figured that one out' :eek:

Hey good thinking(?)... I mean I can see why they'd put in their valuable time in those freerolls so that they can be getting a great hourly from them. They must be able to pull in an easy 46cents per hour... maybe... right??

You couldn't make up any stupider comments if you tried. Oh... I just realized something, you DID make this up.
You can't even do elementary math, so your thoughts are not even worth correcting.
 
Mr_Hand

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To answer the OPs question: Software. There is software with very complex algorithms that track and can find collusion, bots and other forms of cheating. Companies spend millions on this software to insure as cheat free of an experience as they can. Everyone knows it still happens, but it’s not as rampant as it could be without their software.
 
kara260588

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It seems to me that such situations occur in poker.But much more often in the cash game.
 
PaxMundi

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lol, EVERYONE has their price.

Id have to respectfully disagree as corrupt people or people of low character tend to be in the minority thankfully.
 
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danelyCS

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I know I may sound a bit paranoid, but this has been a matter that I sometimes think about, and there's probably nothing anyone can do about. I'm not talking about bots, but about people who team up to have a better advantage over other players.

What prevents people from teaming up?

For example, say 100 people enter the same tournament. These people know each other and share their hands to have a better probabilty of winning. Now, these people don't have to be in the same room, they could probably be living in different countries and continents, but have a way to communicate with each other, so, there's no reason for any room to speculate that they're cheating and has no incentive to not put them togheter in the same table.

Now imagine having two of these people in the same table? Knowing each other hands, rasing and reraising to control the action. Now imagine 3 people in the same table... Now more than 4... Imagine being in a table full of people who know each other's cards against you!

Again, I may seem paranoid, but this can be perfectly doable if people are simply willing to cheat... once, in PokerStars, I was about to register to a 20 dollar SnG, once I saw who was also registered, I quickly unregistered as fast as I could . There were at least 15 people already registered, all from Greece, now I have nothing against people from this place, but it's too much of a coincidence to not be taken into consideration... Again it might just be my paranoic self acting up... ? This is actually the reason why I'm making this topic...

This is definitely the worst aspect about online poker, there is simply no way to know who is behind the other cards.

What do you guys think? Can this happen? Is this happening as we speak? Can we do anything about it? Post your theorys and anectodes.


You know, I thought about it thousands of times, with all the sophisticated ways that there are nowadays to communicate this is totally possible, I several times suspected some people but I did not take the trouble to report them for lack of time.
The way in which I try to prevent this is by playing Spin & Go type of tournaments or Twister in Ipoker Rooms where the players who register are aletorios and nobody knows which players are registered in advance, unfortunately it is dangerous to apparently play tournaments in some rooms, but I think that the technology is able to avoid this type of traps, it is only necessary that the poker rooms take precautions on this but I think that now they do not care.

Also in some rooms it is also possible to change the Nickname on the tables and this is the only thing that makes this kind of cheats help unfortunately.
 
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Collusion is hard to stop butt send a screen shot to the administration if you notice people doing it
 
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