CowboyStomp
Rock Star
Silver Level
Luvepoker
Lost in the twilight zone
Community Guide
The problem is how can you say who is truly the best. I dont think there is any possible way of saying who is the best of all time. Look at the cardplayer player of the year. Some of them are there year after year and make 20+ final tables and winning millions. They must be some of the best but when you look deeper into there final tables, many are the high roller events with 40 to 50 people. Other players like Phil Helmuth or Phil Ivey are not on there, why? They are not playing as many tournaments or just playing high roller events. Events Helmuth plays each year have several hundred to thousands of players in the events he plays. Making a final table where say 1 in 5 make the final table is a accomplishment and I wont take it away from them but making one final table a year where the average players are 800 or 900 would be much more of a accomplishment.
Lets look at players who have won big and compair.
Phil Ivey has won 10 wsop events and WPT.
Doyle Brunson won 2 straight main events and 10 WSOP and a WPT event.
Phil Helmuth has 2 WSOP main event titles MAIN event and WSOP Europe main event. No WPT.
So who is better? Doyle won 2 straight but how many players were there in those days. Ivey has no main event wins but Phil Helmuth has no WPT wins. Helmuth only win the WSOP and cant win on the WPT, How can you decide.
The problem with tournament poker is how often do the best players win. You could actually be the best player in the world and by far and still never win one. Money cant be used as you many win 2 or 3 events with 3000 people in it and not even come close to the amount 2nd place wins in a high roller event. I just don think it possible to say who is best.
What I do think is possible is to define some of the best players ever, I just dont think you could ever say someone is the best ever.
Lets look at players who have won big and compair.
Phil Ivey has won 10 wsop events and WPT.
Doyle Brunson won 2 straight main events and 10 WSOP and a WPT event.
Phil Helmuth has 2 WSOP main event titles MAIN event and WSOP Europe main event. No WPT.
So who is better? Doyle won 2 straight but how many players were there in those days. Ivey has no main event wins but Phil Helmuth has no WPT wins. Helmuth only win the WSOP and cant win on the WPT, How can you decide.
The problem with tournament poker is how often do the best players win. You could actually be the best player in the world and by far and still never win one. Money cant be used as you many win 2 or 3 events with 3000 people in it and not even come close to the amount 2nd place wins in a high roller event. I just don think it possible to say who is best.
What I do think is possible is to define some of the best players ever, I just dont think you could ever say someone is the best ever.
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filippfilm
Rock Star
Bronze Level
Friends I have seen that they refer to Phil Ivey as the best player in history, how true do you think he is? He has won 10 WSOP bracelets, he was one of the best high stakes players. Do you think there is a better player?[/QZ
I think Stu Unger was the coolest poker player of all time.
Pokerpoet2
Legend
Loyaler
I hate the term "Best" He is a great player and will always be a great player but so are so many others Daniel Negreanu, Tom Dwan, even Phil Helmutt, just to name three are also great players, but Phil Helmuth has never won an WPT event.
They might be considered the "Best on the day" when they win a Title, but to be labelled the best in the World, just doesn't seem to make sense, they all have good days, and bad days.
For me, because I am of the age, where I remember some great players of the past, Hold Doyle Brunson as one of my favorite players and probably one of the Greatest, He is certainly a Legend in his own Lifetime and a player who has helped to bring the game out of the back rooms of bars etc into the Real World and made Poker, what it is today.
I respect many of the Great players we have today, but to say who is the "Best" really is a dumb question, there are many players who have made millions, playing on line Poker, some we have never heard of. There are some who have never won an MTT but they make a living from Poker simply by being on the Final tables and making the money regularly.
Consistency is the secret to Poker success, not just winning the odd title, or bracelet, but constantly being in the money most of the time.
I have seen all the above players lose games, and hundreds of thousands of Dollars, even Doyle Brunson has his bad days, but I still consider him to be one of the greatest players of all time.
When the fun Stops, STOP!
They might be considered the "Best on the day" when they win a Title, but to be labelled the best in the World, just doesn't seem to make sense, they all have good days, and bad days.
For me, because I am of the age, where I remember some great players of the past, Hold Doyle Brunson as one of my favorite players and probably one of the Greatest, He is certainly a Legend in his own Lifetime and a player who has helped to bring the game out of the back rooms of bars etc into the Real World and made Poker, what it is today.
I respect many of the Great players we have today, but to say who is the "Best" really is a dumb question, there are many players who have made millions, playing on line Poker, some we have never heard of. There are some who have never won an MTT but they make a living from Poker simply by being on the Final tables and making the money regularly.
Consistency is the secret to Poker success, not just winning the odd title, or bracelet, but constantly being in the money most of the time.
I have seen all the above players lose games, and hundreds of thousands of Dollars, even Doyle Brunson has his bad days, but I still consider him to be one of the greatest players of all time.
When the fun Stops, STOP!
jsnake716
Legend
Bronze Level
Another "legend" , Phil was a great player when the U.S. was going through the biggest poker boom ever. Does this make him the greatest ever? I don't know, and how would you attempt to judge the greatest ever? This is one of those questions that is just anyone's opinion and that is OK. I really like the fact that Phil has come back and is doing well, after the game has changed. To me, anyone who can stay near the top of anything for more than 10 years shows that they have exceptional talent and desire to put in enough work to keep pace with current trends.
Chebchoub
Legend
Platinum Level
Friends I have seen that they refer to Phil Ivey as the best player in history, how true do you think he is? He has won 10 WSOP bracelets, he was one of the best high stakes players. Do you think there is a better player?
There is no best poker player ever. I think they are all the best and the thing that distinguishes them from the rest of the ordinary players is the good results that they achieve over and over again.
VITOS
Visionary
Bronze Level
Phil Ivey is one of the best poker players in the world. To date, he is the only African-American of this level, is among the richest poker players,
he is also one of the youngest professionals.
Phil Ivey showed interest in gambling almost from early childhood.
His biography contains many victories both in tournaments and in the cash game among professionals of the highest class.
Phil was born in the United States on February 1, 1976 in Riverside, California, but in early childhood the family moved to Rozelle, New Jersey.
At the age of 8, he learned to play cards, and in his teens he already played in a casino.
Phil Ivey started playing poker with friends and acquaintances at work in the 90s, after which he later decided to take up poker professionally. Almost all professional players have come a long way from the very bottom, up to the highest stages of his career, Phil Ivey went the same way. A video of his participation in poker tournaments shows us his restrained and calm style of play, at the table, he practically does not talk, he is completely focused.
No expression of emotion can be seen on his face, his self-control is almost brought to perfection – during the game Phil Ivey expresses impartiality.
he is also one of the youngest professionals.
Phil Ivey showed interest in gambling almost from early childhood.
His biography contains many victories both in tournaments and in the cash game among professionals of the highest class.
Phil was born in the United States on February 1, 1976 in Riverside, California, but in early childhood the family moved to Rozelle, New Jersey.
At the age of 8, he learned to play cards, and in his teens he already played in a casino.
Phil Ivey started playing poker with friends and acquaintances at work in the 90s, after which he later decided to take up poker professionally. Almost all professional players have come a long way from the very bottom, up to the highest stages of his career, Phil Ivey went the same way. A video of his participation in poker tournaments shows us his restrained and calm style of play, at the table, he practically does not talk, he is completely focused.
No expression of emotion can be seen on his face, his self-control is almost brought to perfection – during the game Phil Ivey expresses impartiality.
Sivraj
Rock Star
Silver Level
Sir you said it best! I honestly don't think there is a such thing as the best poker player ever but there are definitely some great consistent legends that we can respect and learn from. And Ivey is a household name that is definitely feared and respected. But there is also great other players like Negreanu, Dean, Hellmuth, Bringing, the list goes on.
D
DS3
Legend
Loyaler
I really like Ivey. But the problem with this type of thread lies in a few directions.
The first is that there is no metric to indisputably compare top players. One false argument is most money 'officially' made. Even then that does not include the considerable buy-ins involved which often produces losses. And it is a clueless measure when many of the top players pay cash games in private.
But lets face it, the real issue with these threads is what they really are is a popularity contest. Who's you favorite player?
Nothing wrong with that but dressing it up as a 'serious' debate is not really worthwhile.
And for what it is worth, many would argue Stu Ungar was potentially the best player ever, and no doubt Phil Ivey would likely agree as many other pro's have done in the past.
The first is that there is no metric to indisputably compare top players. One false argument is most money 'officially' made. Even then that does not include the considerable buy-ins involved which often produces losses. And it is a clueless measure when many of the top players pay cash games in private.
But lets face it, the real issue with these threads is what they really are is a popularity contest. Who's you favorite player?
Nothing wrong with that but dressing it up as a 'serious' debate is not really worthwhile.
And for what it is worth, many would argue Stu Ungar was potentially the best player ever, and no doubt Phil Ivey would likely agree as many other pro's have done in the past.
C
Carlloss
Rock Star
Bronze Level
If it's not the best, it's certainly one of the best in history. Offline would be in the top 3 for sure, alongside Tom "durrrr" Dwan and Negreanu. Phil Hellmuth is also a fantastic player, but he is also one of the worst people, extremely arrogant and uneducated.
Whaevoz
Legend
Platinum Level
I guess it is easy to have a great poker face when you don't have a sense of humor or much of a personality. But yes, Phil is one of the greats. Too bad he is so ethically challenged.
Guess you can tell I'm not a fan...
Guess you can tell I'm not a fan...
