Exact stack size bet

K_Kahne_Fan

K_Kahne_Fan

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When I have stack larger than another player I will typically bet their stack size. Is that frowned upon, or does it not matter one way or another? When I'm short stacked and the large stack pushes all their chips it always seems a little overkill to me. Here's an example hand...

pokerstars Game #16409670860: Tournament #83093112, $3.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2008/04/01 - 11:42:40 (ET)
Table '83093112 1' 10-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 3: 09kKahneFan (10325 in chips)
Seat 8: BzZRain (1695 in chips)
Seat 9: jannebc (2980 in chips)
09kKahneFan: posts the ante 25
BzZRain: posts the ante 25
jannebc: posts the ante 25
09kKahneFan: posts small blind 200
BzZRain: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to 09kKahneFan [:ad4: :qs4:]
jannebc: folds
09kKahneFan: raises 1270 to 1670 (should've been 1695, but close enough)
BzZRain: folds
09kKahneFan collected 875 from pot
09kKahneFan: doesn't show hand


Should I put in like $2K here since it would cover him, or was the (almost) stack size bet ok? Either way it puts them all in, I just don't want to look like a jerk when I do so.
 
zachvac

zachvac

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it really doesn't matter. I know some people will put in their stack size-1 but if you're going to play for stacks it doesn't matter if you go all-in, bet their exact stack size, or bet any amount more than their stack size. I don't think it's considered acting like a jerk no matter what you do since you are essentially doing the same thing.
 
aliengenius

aliengenius

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Be careful of giving off information/tells this way: typically a bet of exactly the opponents stack is indicative of a very strong hand.
 
shinedown.45

shinedown.45

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Now I understand the reason ppl put in enough just to cover an individuals' stack sizes :)
 
S

switch0723

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i always do it against the shortstacks when i have a stack much larger than theirs. Sicne it makes the most sense, if you make a standard bet, it gives them the option to come over the top with the little fold equity they have, but putting them all in removes that and gives them the decision.

So what if you look like a jerk? Phil Hellmuth gets away with it
 
KingCurtis

KingCurtis

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i did one today and won but i agree with aliengenius it can be viewed as a strong hand, but smart people on the other hand could use it that way to bluff....
 
nevadanick

nevadanick

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Be careful of giving off information/tells this way: typically a bet of exactly the opponents stack is indicative of a very strong hand.

^^^ this might be true where most table players understand NL poker betting, but not sure it applies all that often online unless they are known/regular players.

Communication by voice is hard enough for many. Communication by bet size is another animal. In a HU hand it's just a matter of choice. How the opponent interprets that bet is unknown. One would say an all-in is overkill while another will say an exact stack bet is a 'double dare ya' bet (as AG said). Then you just need to decide if it's the big stack trying to buy the pot, or does he really have that 'strong hand'?

Are big chippers ever bullies ?? ... :D
 
PokerVic

PokerVic

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I always do this in tournaments when I'm putting someone all-in. It's a not-so-gentle reminder that my tournament life is not in danger, but his is. But, I agree, be sure to do this either all the time or none of the time, so as not to give away a strong hand.
 
zachvac

zachvac

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i always do it against the shortstacks when i have a stack much larger than theirs. Sicne it makes the most sense, if you make a standard bet, it gives them the option to come over the top with the little fold equity they have, but putting them all in removes that and gives them the decision.

So what if you look like a jerk? Phil Hellmuth gets away with it

Well I think his question was putting him all-in or going all-in yourself. So if you have 2k chips and your opponent has 500 chips do you bet 500? 2k? Somewhere in between? I says it doesn't really matter. I usually do a normal amount just over their stack. Since I'm almost always doing cash games if they have like $5.75 or something I'll bet $6 or something of that nature. But especially if they bet first and I want to go all-in I'm not going to do the subtraction to find out how much I need to bet to put him all-in. That would mean doing math :p. So usually if bet into and I want to go all-in I'll just shove but if I'm betting into him it's usually either his stack exactly or an even number above his stack.
 
K_Kahne_Fan

K_Kahne_Fan

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That would mean doing math :p.

WHAT?! Someone call the presses! Zach complained about doing math!!!! :D :p

As for tells, I do it everytime I have someone outstacked, so I'm consistant in my personal tell - which gives none. Usually I bet 3-5xBB standard raise, so if they're within that, or a little above, I will push them. Also, I think it could be seen either as "I have a strong hand" or "I know you won't call this (bully bet)", so if they have a strong hand and they see it as the latter, they would probably call thinking you may have nothing. Either way I usually only do it with decent hands (as above).
 
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