Why is bad the new good in terms of poker strategy?

Mikeisanace777

Mikeisanace777

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Say what you will bad players simply do better when they apply this terrible strategy. It's really implied odds and they don't play bad all the time otherwise they would go broke instead it seems they care little about their cash,say even in a live game they will call perfect bets for ''YOU'' The good player with 22 on a board of say 8-9-10 with 2 spades. You raise from utg at blinds 5-10 to a lil over bet of 56 dollars with a-10 off in a 6 handed game all are loose weak players. You get 3 callers the flop comes 8-9-10 as described your pretty good here, but you play it cautiously and bet out 40 to 65% of the pot and get 2 callers,turn is a 2 giving him that hidden hand and you again bet out 60% of the pot everyone folds but him now heads up. River Ace of blank no flushes you have 2 pair,but he kept calling so you check the river and he bets out 50% of the pot or lil more. You say well maybe he flopped it,or he is buying it so i'm committed and you call only to see his ducks!! You say nice hand to a guy who flopped the straight and maybe think to yourself well maybe I over played top pair oh well. I keep running in to these situations I only win when I have a monster hand with a solid draw to back it up like A-K hearts flop A-7-4 2 hearts only then will I out flush 4-7 2 pair or a miracle river set. The thing is in weaker games I myself open up to more hands in position like k-9 spades,or q-10 off. I get callers folders and one guy that keeps calling my bet proportional raises in relation to the pot when I flop top pair on good boards! He wont go away and rivers or turns some weak ass 2 pair. I know I know this is a good thing,well maybe over a 5,000 sample with me and him heads up,but I'm losing to these guys and they are always different playing rags then decent hands and I never lose to their good hands as it's obvious they have it and only keep calling my when they have me covered.
 
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SteadyStackin

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Couldn't have said it better! Would like to hear some solutions on this. Before I actually studied poker and learned what starting hands to raise with, I won more money, now the strategy I have learned over the past couple of weeks and put into practice is costing me money for the exact same reason you stated.
 
Mikeisanace777

Mikeisanace777

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yup

I agree im thinking maybe you need out proportional hands to be ideally only in your open up hands. Such as j-8 to k9 suited always suited of extra outs and hidden straights. This way maybe on flops like k-q-2 flops of your flushy draw so a smaller bet can induce a call to this guy if the situation arises and if he hits his 5 for 2 pair k-5 you can still continue to a river win without only having one pair even if it's ak. This way for k-9 spaded you can get a 9 a spade for the flush and even a q for the counterfeit.
 
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braveslice

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... I have learned over the past couple of weeks and put into practice is costing me money for the exact same reason you stated.

This is very typical what happens, learning anything new usually costs you in poker. Even high level players go down on limits to implement new strategies, so they would not lose that much.

Reason for this is the learning process Level1: You learn a new thing by remembering it imperfectly/partly 2. You learn/remember the new thing by heart 3. You are adept enough to know how to apply and adapt the new thing given live situation 4. You are adept enough to teach this new thing to others, meaning you know why/what/when

Only on levels 3 and 4, you are expected to make money in poker. Poker forums are so efficient because we practice here Level4 learning by giving answers, and are also hoping answers from Level4 so that we can ask things we don’t understand.
 
n3rv

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In terms of learning Poker, I'd say 99% is experience. Yes, it is good to learn new things, but not put them ahead of your own gut and reasoning and based on your previous intuitive learning of the game you are in. Phil Ivey never read a book. The book never read your table either. Trying out new strategies costs money. And you eventually only use that strategy 1% of the time instead of 100%. It is very useful to have learnt a new strategy but only when you decide you need it and don't blame it for right or wrong decisions at the table. No one ever really knows your specific personal values at any given time. They could be very different to your opponent, and very different to the book. So, if you feel that blindly following one strategy is costing you money in a game, then you have to protect yourself against that. Some players like to ride out variance, others like to nuance their style. Experience of both can help.
 
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SteadyStackin

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This is very typical what happens, learning anything new usually costs you in poker. Even high level players go down on limits to implement new strategies, so they would not lose that much.

Reason for this is the learning process Level1: You learn a new thing by remembering it imperfectly/partly 2. You learn/remember the new thing by heart 3. You are adept enough to know how to apply and adapt the new thing given live situation 4. You are adept enough to teach this new thing to others, meaning you know why/what/when

Only on levels 3 and 4, you are expected to make money in poker. Poker forums are so efficient because we practice here Level4 learning by giving answers, and are also hoping answers from Level4 so that we can ask things we don’t understand.
Thankyou
 
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SteadyStackin

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In terms of learning Poker, I'd say 99% is experience. Yes, it is good to learn new things, but not put them ahead of your own gut and reasoning and based on your previous intuitive learning of the game you are in. Phil Ivey never read a book. The book never read your table either. Trying out new strategies costs money. And you eventually only use that strategy 1% of the time instead of 100%. It is very useful to have learnt a new strategy but only when you decide you need it and don't blame it for right or wrong decisions at the table. No one ever really knows your specific personal values at any given time. They could be very different to your opponent, and very different to the book. So, if you feel that blindly following one strategy is costing you money in a game, then you have to protect yourself against that. Some players like to ride out variance, others like to nuance their style. Experience of both can help.
Thankyou
 
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Smokewood

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MOVE UP IN STAKES!!!

You cannot use advanced poker strats at the micros.
The micros = NIT city and fat value only.
 
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braveslice

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MOVE UP IN STAKES!!!

You cannot use advanced poker strats at the micros.
The micros = NIT city and fat value only.

Yeah if I run very bad in 2NL, I go to 100NL zoom and make some couple of thousands, this is great way to support your roll in 2NL to withstand bad players. Much better than boring freerolls. Great advice!
 
BuzzKillington

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MOVE UP IN STAKES!!!

You cannot use advanced poker strats at the micros.
The micros = NIT city and fat value only.
Encouraging beginners to move up in stakes, when they clearly aren't ready for it, is the same as telling them to throw their money away.

I don't know what your intentions are, but some of your posts are quite harmful.
 
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Smokewood

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Encouraging beginners to move up in stakes, when they clearly aren't ready for it, is the same as telling them to throw their money away.

I don't know what your intentions are, but some of your posts are quite harmful.

You clearly cannot read very well then.....:joyman:
 
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