Stacking off with One Pair hands

MatMackenz

MatMackenz

Visionary
I always seem to be getting into trouble with my single pair hands. How is the best way to play these hands like TPTK? I seem to be getting a bit too excited and end up stacking off when I know that I could easy be beat. Like if I hit TPTK and I raise and get re-raised, I will end up getting in my whole stack, and lose too a Set or Two-Pair hand.

When I hit a nice pair or have overpair, what should be done?

Should we play aggressive, but cautious when met with resistance?

Should we bet smaller to not have our whole stack at risk by the river with only a pair?

I have a very hard time finding the fold button here.
 
Misaki

Misaki

Visionary
Awards
6
it mostly depends vs who you play, what positions you are, did you open preflop or just called etc. It's impossible to answer you in few words. Topic is huge. Most of the time TPTK is good to get 3 streets of value but you have to be careful if someone shows you some aggresion. You always have to think about villain's range. What hands do you beat, what combinations beats you. You should always look if your TPTK is good vs a range which give you an action. Poker is not that simple. If I would like to ask your question then bet bigger like 2/3-3/4. Versus a fish even 90-100%. When someone raises you then think if he is aggresive postflop, does he has many better hands than yours, if board is drawy etc. everything is about ranges.
 
A

AG04CAS

Enthusiast
You didnt say what level your playing at as different stakes require different approaches.....

microstakes TPTK ......at this level flop not too worried but if your opponent is betting into you ...raising or reraising on turn or river.....fold ......your one pair is beat

They simply have you beat......this includes AA/ KK/QQ....

Me I play my one pair very cautiously 40/50% bets and i never stack off unless i have played against my opponent a lot .... at micros they turn up with anything...but the best read you will ever get is them betting into you turn/river .

I know some of the micro regs will say they can easily exploit that but I dont play against 22/20 regs ... I play against fish.....and they tell you when they are good

Find the fold button and save yourself a lot of money and tilt time
 
Dusan

Dusan

Enthusiast
If you are a good player, you'll always be the midst of a series of shifting events and so you never can at any moment consider the whole import of an event that is occurring. Moment by moment the event is imperceptibly shaping itself, and at every moment of this continuous, uninterrupted shaping of events the player is in the midst of a most complex play of intrigues, worries, contingencies, threats, and is continually obliged to reply to innumerable questions addressed to him, which constantly conflict with one another.
 
MemphisGrind

MemphisGrind

Think Bink
Awards
2
I always seem to be getting into trouble with my single pair hands. How is the best way to play these hands like TPTK? I seem to be getting a bit too excited and end up stacking off when I know that I could easy be beat. Like if I hit TPTK and I raise and get re-raised, I will end up getting in my whole stack, and lose too a Set or Two-Pair hand.

When I hit a nice pair or have overpair, what should be done?

Should we play aggressive, but cautious when met with resistance?

Should we bet smaller to not have our whole stack at risk by the river with only a pair?

I have a very hard time finding the fold button here.


You are either ahead of your opponents range or not.. Gain as much information as you can to narrow your opponents range down, and if you are ahead of your opponents range more often than not then you call if your're behind opponents range you fold.
 
MemphisGrind

MemphisGrind

Think Bink
Awards
2
If you are a good player, you'll always be the midst of a series of shifting events and so you never can at any moment consider the whole import of an event that is occurring. Moment by moment the event is imperceptibly shaping itself, and at every moment of this continuous, uninterrupted shaping of events the player is in the midst of a most complex play of intrigues, worries, contingencies, threats, and is continually obliged to reply to innumerable questions addressed to him, which constantly conflict with one another.

Not trying to make fun of you I promise..... but... this reminded me of when I was in school and had to write a paper that was 1000 words, but could only come up with like 500. This made my day. The information is relevant, it just made me chuckle the way it was portrayed. Again, not making fun of you! just enjoyed it.
 
S

Sorin Iliescu

Rock Star
Depend on the oppoenents and playing styles. There are some that only bet with the good hands so you can sometimes fold your hands. There are others who bluff a lot. You just need to adjust.
 
S

Spewster

Enthusiast
Ok, so this question cannot be answered in a few sentences. It depends on the flop, your position and the villains position.

Lets say, villain raised from UTG and you called from the button with JTs. Flop comes T34r. Villain cbets, you call, turn comes a brick, villain checks.

In this case your TP middle kicker is good.

Lets say villain raises from UTG, you 3bet with AKo, villain calls and flop comes AQ7r. Villain bets, you raise, villain reraises.

In this instance you are probably playing against a set or two pair and you are behind.


As a general rule, you want to think about villains range preflop and how the flop hit his range. For example open raises from EP have a lot of premium hands and mid/broadway pocket pairs. If the flop comes broadway rainbow, chances are good that he hit something.

If the flop comes mid/low cards monotone or double suited, he probably missed, but either cbets his A high or his overpair.


When you have an idea how his range connects with the flop, you can make an educated guess about where you are in your range with TPTK.

The better he connected, the deeper effective stacks are and the more draws there are on the board the weaker your TPTK is.

If he did not connect well, the board is dry and effetive stacks are short, then you can fastplay TPTK.



The biggest mistake is not watching villainst position and stack size. If effective stacks are 200+BB and the board is wet (str8, flush probably paired board), your TPTK is basically a bluff catcher.
 
MatMackenz

MatMackenz

Visionary
To further clarify, I am specifically talking about times when we are met with serious aggression post-flop. Like a re-raise or check-raise situation.

Can we just always assume we are beat here and fold? Obviously it depends on the situation, but sets can be present on any board at any time.. same with two pairs.

What line should we take say if we hit TPTK on the flop against an unknown villain. We bet the flop and are met with a big re-raise... what to do now?
 
NWPatriot

NWPatriot

Rock Star
I am writing a book for my own purposes - gathering data, capturing thoughts, jotting down strategies and key learnings. One of my "chapters" is titled "PAIRS SUCK".

This is probably one of the reasons why Hold'em is so difficult to master. We spend most of our time with mediocre hands trying to out maneuver other people with mediocre hands. My personal rule is to never go all in with just a pair - I am too vulnerable to invisible hands like 2 pairs and 3 of a kinds. I think it is best to play them smart and play them well, but i have been knocked out of more tournaments with a pair (yes A's and K's), than with any other hand. So... if they are this fragile, why would i want to go all in with them.

Of course you can't just fold them either, because a large percentage of the time, this is all you will have (and all your opponent has also). The question is how to play them? Pot management and payer observation are keys to playing pairs.

But of course, I haven't won my first million yet...
 
copycutpaste

copycutpaste

Rock Star
Poker is a fluid game and table dynamics change a lot based on cards dealt and community cards...answering your question is nearly impossible without knowing board texture, position and pot odds etc...

If you are a good student of the game and took the role of aggressor in the hand that's all you can do...if you are playing against a calling station you are going to be beat from time to time...that's just poker variance...good luck
 
S

Spewster

Enthusiast
To further clarify, I am specifically talking about times when we are met with serious aggression post-flop. Like a re-raise or check-raise situation.

Can we just always assume we are beat here and fold? Obviously it depends on the situation, but sets can be present on any board at any time.. same with two pairs.

What line should we take say if we hit TPTK on the flop against an unknown villain. We bet the flop and are met with a big re-raise... what to do now?


What I was trying to say: You just cannot generalise that question. It depends mostly on stacksize.

If you are 300bb deep you raise AK 4bb pre from BTN and the BB, who is 50BB deep, calls. Flop comes AQ2 and BB shoves, you call of course.

But consider the same situation with the same hand and the same flop, but now BB is also 300bb deep, he checks you bet and he raises you...probably your hand is not good here. Because he knows that you know that both of you are not playing for the pot but for each players stack, he probably won't raise you with a mediocre hand. He might bluff you, but he wont raise with a weak Ace.


The deeper the stacks the bigger your hand needs to be to continue or the more outs you need. Lets say you have AdKd is suited and you hit a combo draw on the flop As Qd2d, you can call, as any A, K, any diamond will improve your hand.

If the same flop is rainbow, the only hands that will raise you are 22, QQ, AQ or bluffs.
 
MemphisGrind

MemphisGrind

Think Bink
Awards
2
To further clarify, I am specifically talking about times when we are met with serious aggression post-flop. Like a re-raise or check-raise situation.

Can we just always assume we are beat here and fold? Obviously it depends on the situation, but sets can be present on any board at any time.. same with two pairs.

What line should we take say if we hit TPTK on the flop against an unknown villain. We bet the flop and are met with a big re-raise... what to do now?

Again, As previously stated in my last message. If you are ahead of villains range You call if you are behind villains range you fold. If you break down "Uknown" villains range always assume TAG until you gain more information about them. which it's rather hard to have NO information on someone.
 
MatMackenz

MatMackenz

Visionary
I am writing a book for my own purposes - gathering data, capturing thoughts, jotting down strategies and key learnings. One of my "chapters" is titled "PAIRS SUCK".

This is probably one of the reasons why Hold'em is so difficult to master. We spend most of our time with mediocre hands trying to out maneuver other people with mediocre hands. My personal rule is to never go all in with just a pair - I am too vulnerable to invisible hands like 2 pairs and 3 of a kinds. I think it is best to play them smart and play them well, but i have been knocked out of more tournaments with a pair (yes A's and K's), than with any other hand. So... if they are this fragile, why would i want to go all in with them.

Of course you can't just fold them either, because a large percentage of the time, this is all you will have (and all your opponent has also). The question is how to play them? Pot management and payer observation are keys to playing pairs.

But of course, I haven't won my first million yet...


Thank you this response.. these are hands that I seem to be having the most trouble with in the micro-limit cash games. The hidden two pair or set which I have lost many pots too. I don't try to get my stacks in, but sometimes I have trouble to fold the hand to aggression.

I have also won many big pots here as some of these players will get stacks in with draws or weaker pairs. I will try to not build a big pot unless my hand is better.

I mostly play the tournaments so not so much experience with cash game. Im in no way a losing player... I am actually up quite significantly in the last 2 months even tho I am making some huge mistakes. I just got the tracking software and hud so I will be able to have some better reads on my opponents.
 
L

Lezaleas

Rising Star
fish at the micros almost always raise for value. now, they can be value raising middle pair or something, but more often than not when they show aggression you are beat.
 
blueskies

blueskies

Legend
Awards
9
If you are playing at the bottom level, it is ok to stack off with TPTK, and even worse, because you will be called by far worse.

Against better competition, it's best to slow down if you encounter resistance. Really depends on villain style and board texture.

And on stack size, if you are short stacked, just shove it. Deep stacked, be more cautious.

I always seem to be getting into trouble with my single pair hands. How is the best way to play these hands like TPTK? I seem to be getting a bit too excited and end up stacking off when I know that I could easy be beat. Like if I hit TPTK and I raise and get re-raised, I will end up getting in my whole stack, and lose too a Set or Two-Pair hand.

When I hit a nice pair or have overpair, what should be done?

Should we play aggressive, but cautious when met with resistance?

Should we bet smaller to not have our whole stack at risk by the river with only a pair?

I have a very hard time finding the fold button here.
 
MatMackenz

MatMackenz

Visionary
If you are playing at the bottom level, it is ok to stack off with TPTK, and even worse, because you will be called by far worse.

Against better competition, it's best to slow down if you encounter resistance. Really depends on villain style and board texture.

And on stack size, if you are short stacked, just shove it. Deep stacked, be more cautious.


This is at as low as it gets.. 6-man SNAP on 888. 1$ is max buyin at the 0.02$ blind level. Yes I have noticed lots of people stacking off even with air here lol, this is maybe why I am not folding as much as I should be. I have started to label the villains so I can tell which of them are overly aggressive and which ones are more passive and likely to have it when they start shoving.
 
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