What are you guys unsure about? I mean, is it how outs relate to odds, or what we mean when we say "six-to-one" or the relationship between percentages and odds, or...?I'd like to find a whole bunch of test questions for different situations. I keep thinking I understand, but then I'm not sure.
eg: What were my odds here and should have I called
if you think that a 7 or a 4 will win it for you then you have 6 outs.
-On the turn: multiply the number of outs by 4
-On the river: multiply the number of outs by 2
Its not 100% accurate, but its very close.
Pot Odds: pretty simple stuff. $100 pot and its $10 to call. You're getting 10:1 odds.
Some people think you shouldn't look at multiplying by 4 on the turn because there's a good chance you're going to have to bet again on the turn, so just look at each card/betting situation as one time odds.
True. The total cost of seeing the river (or showdown) is sometimes referred to as effective odds.Some people think you shouldn't look at multiplying by 4 on the turn because there's a good chance you're going to have to bet again on the turn, so just look at each card/betting situation as one time odds.
No, although this is a common misconception. Odds are used to calculate break-even points, and as such you're looking at profit, not size of the pot. When your opponent bets $10 into the $90 pot, thus giving you 10:1, your profit if you win will not be $110, it will only be $100. Your loss, if you lose, will be $10. That's the relationship the odds show: Profit:Loss. 100:10.And question; $100 pot, $10 to call, is this not 11-1 odds as it costs you $10 to win $110 after you call?
One of the first chapters in Small Stakes Hold 'em by Ed Miller has one of the best sections on counting outs I've seen. I recommend it.I still think I need practice doing the math in my head too. Although that should be simple enough to make up stuff. .. $56 pot, $8 to call, I've got a straight draw, but count the upper card as only 2 outs as they might not be good ...
To answer the original question, I believe you can be a winning, but not expert, no-limit player without playing by the odds. "Successful" is a term that means different things to different people, though.Can you be a successful poker player without knowing about or figuring out odds? Do thy matter that much? And if they do, what can you do if you are very mathmatecally challenge?
To answer the original question, I believe you can be a winning, but not expert, no-limit player without playing by the odds. "Successful" is a term that means different things to different people, though.
No, although this is a common misconception. Odds are used to calculate break-even points, and as such you're looking at profit, not size of the pot. When your opponent bets $10 into the $90 pot, thus giving you 10:1, your profit if you win will not be $110, it will only be $100. Your loss, if you lose, will be $10. That's the relationship the odds show: Profit:Loss. 100:10.
And a lot of the time, the bets you're being asked to call in NL are pot-sized, meaning that you usually have a fairly straightforward decision ("is my hand good or will improve to win, one-time-in-three?"), whereas a lot of the time in limit, you're looking at 7:1, or 9.5:1 decisions where "I'm probably behind" isn't good enough to make the correct decision. This is why limit players that don't know (or don't care) about odds quickly lose their bankroll.As fp said limit is a game of odds so u cant really play tht but nl i think you can be a very good player without knowing the exact odds of every hnd tho being able to read patterns of play is more important if you dont.
Tenbob, I would love to see a guide for dummies like me. I can do it in my head, and I understand how to count my outs, etc., but I am unsure of what are the correct odds to call, etc. I think Medeiros' post has helped a little though. So, if you have a 36% chance of making your hand, you shouldn't call off more than a 36% size of pot bet? Did I read that right...BBB did you get and understand all of that ?
Let me know if you didnt and ill go do a pot odd guide for dummies type thing. The thing that amuses me lots on poker forums, is that if someone starts a thread like this stating that they have a hatred of math, there is sure to be a waft of math related replies to it. Unfortunatlly in a lot, but not all cases its essential.