Playing Any 2 suited cards

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coljung

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I'm in need of some help.

I usually play $2 and $5 SnG as well as MTT and I'm having extreme difficulties playing with people that call raises with ANY 2 suited cards.

I'm no talking of A# of K#, i mean more like J-2, 10-6, 9-5, 4-3.

Every day i play against this people and more often than not i end up losing against them. I think these are considered bad plays, but they win so often....

Anyways, I'm just pissed because I played 2 tourneys today and lost both in a similar fashion, I raised pre flop, get one caller , and ended up losing both times. One vs J6 suited, the other vs 43 suited. But it's not just today, I see it all the time, and to me it makes it harder to read them because they may be calling with anything. Also it didn't help that i wasn't hitting any flops.

So, one of the approaches I've taken is that whenever I'm playing HU with any of them and there's a flush draw, I'll play carefully.

And i know that given the right flop it's easy to trap these players, it's just that I havent been getting many good flops lately.

So, any ideas on how to play against them ?

Btw, I play mostly TAG, and lately i've been playing quite tight, but still, they see me fold over and over again, then when I raise 4 -5 BB, they stil call with any 2 suited cards.....:mad:, and then the flop is full of rags..
 
OzExorcist

OzExorcist

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So, one of the approaches I've taken is that whenever I'm playing HU with any of them and there's a flush draw, I'll play carefully.

By 'carefully', do you mean checking / betting lower amounts?

This is actually the worst thing you can do if you put your opponent on this type of hand, as you're giving them cheap (or even free) opportunities to make their flush.

So instead, make them pay to draw. They'll hit about 35% of the time (if you let them see the river) and the rest of the time you'll take their money. Take enough of their money on the times that they don't hit, and you should come out ahead.
 
cjroc

cjroc

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A good(big) continuation bet on the flop might prevent them from getting to the turn and river. Like Oz said in the post above, the worst thing to do is give them free or cheap cards.
 
Cheetah

Cheetah

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You were just unlucky. Don't change your game based on their incorrect play.

I know it is frustrating to lose to a donk who called a preflop raise with J2s, but if they all played correctly, there would be no profit in the game. They are definitly making a mistake playing such garbage and will pay for it in the long run.

As the previous posters said, don't play timidly on the flop as you are giving them more chances to outdraw you. Try to play in position against these players and bet bigger amounts if your stack allows it.

Soon or later, their luck will run out. Just be there to collect the cash.:)
 
riverboatrat

riverboatrat

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decent sized c-bets can normally discourage flush chasers, particularly with crap suited cards.

If the flop is a rainbow flop, a smallish c-bet might still get someone to call hoping for running cards to make a flush on the river.

if the turn shows a fluish draw, I make sure that I make a bet thats going to cost the villain dearly if he misses the river.

if the turn does not show a potential flush draw, a smaller probe bet will be able to assist you in understanding what the person is holding, maybe middle pair or similar, a higher bet on the turn may get them to fold but if you suspect them of chasing a draw while only holding middle pair , you still want them to call , so a smaller bet may well be in order here.

if you however are on a nut flush draw against a villain who you have pegged as playing any suited cards, then it may be worth your while to try and bleed them dry with smaller bets on the flop and turn, if you hit your flush you can push, almost certain that they themselves will call with the lower flush.
 
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coljung

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I think as someone said I wasn't very lucky as i wasn't hitting any flops and they were hitting at least a pair, and it has happened to me that they'll bet their par no matter what the bet is. Also my stack sizes weren't that big so it was harder to push them away.

But yes, I did play weakly towards the end whenever there was a flush already on the board. And i did make it expensive if there was a flush draw.

Also as someone said these are the kind of players that more often than not end up losing and I've seen that, but the last couple of days I've been on the opposite side of the equation.
 
dj11

dj11

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In the big game of poker, all things are possible.

Once I get above average in a MTT, I will loosen up and occasionally play suited cards, would really prefer connectors, but a big little suited hand in position is better than many hands. I seldom raise with these semi rags, and will usually fold them at the first sign of resistance, but when I can limp, (am allowed to limp), I will. Flushes don't pan out from preflop often, I'll use a very loose figure of 10%, so when they do pan out I have to make a lot to cover those times when they didn't pan out. I do not have to make 10x here, because I will occasionally flop trips, or the big pair, or 2 pair, or rarely fill a str8, all are surprises, as I was originally seeking the flush draw.

The key for me is to see a cheap flop. I would only call a small raise if I was A-little suited, and it is unlikely that I chase unless something spectacular happens on the flop.

You can put small connectors in that same bag. In position, 56o can play very nicely. Again, be eager to fold these with a bad flop or any resistance.

This is why proper betting is so important. If you limp your monsters, thinking slow play, I will slow play you to your funeral.
 
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coljung

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Here's a perfect example of me raising preflop, getting a caller then ...

Full Tilt Poker Game #3953657542: $2 + $0.25 Sit & Go (30073430), Table 1 - 25/50 - No Limit Hold'em - 15:05:10 ET - 2007/10/24
Seat 2: Sixx75 (510)
Seat 3: takingbacksurfi (3,015)
Seat 4: Hitman1st (1,065)
Seat 5: dachs21 (2,210)
Seat 6: weatherguy75 (865)
Seat 8: Coljung (1,190)
Seat 9: FF_Gabe (4,645)
Sixx75 posts the small blind of 25
takingbacksurfi posts the big blind of 50
The button is in seat #9
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Coljung [Td As]
Hitman1st has 15 seconds left to act
Hitman1st folds
dachs21 folds
weatherguy75 folds
Coljung raises to 200
FF_Gabe folds
Sixx75 folds
takingbacksurfi calls 150
*** FLOP *** [5h 8s Th]
takingbacksurfi bets 50
Coljung raises to 200
takingbacksurfi calls 150
*** TURN *** [5h 8s Th] K♣
takingbacksurfi bets 550
Coljung raises to 790, and is all in
takingbacksurfi calls 240
Coljung shows [Td As]
takingbacksurfi shows [8h 3h]
*** RIVER *** [5h 8s Th Kc] [4h] <----------------- @#$!!@@
Coljung shows a pair of Tens
takingbacksurfi shows a flush, Ten high
takingbacksurfi wins the pot (2,380) with a flush, Ten high
Coljung stands up
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 2,430 | Rake 0
Board: [5h 8s Th Kc 4h]
Seat 2: Sixx75 (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 3: takingbacksurfi (big blind) showed [8h 3h] and won (2,430) with a flush, Ten high
Seat 4: Hitman1st didn't bet (folded)
Seat 5: dachs21 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 6: weatherguy75 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 8: Coljung showed [Td As] and lost with a pair of Tens
Seat 9: FF_Gabe (button) didn't bet (folded)
Well maybe my all-in on the turn wasn't the best, but i was ahead and my read was right, but once again, the #!@#!@ donk gets lucky. :mad:
 
19RK64

19RK64

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It seems playing online,has and is producing a different way and/or style of playing,when I raise preflop I try to think who's going to call, did they just call cause they just wanted to see the flop, did I raise enough?must be carefull,after player is able to see flop,it very hard to stop them from chacing, a possible flush,or strait, no matter,what the bet.nice read
 
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coljung

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Shit, the 3 games that I played today, the 3 of them I lost to a FLUSH on the RIVER, same thing. Only the last one I played wasn't a questionable call , but still got beaten by runner runner clubs. Damn, I'm going to stop playing for a couple of days for my luck to come back.
 
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Bigwerm

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I hate suited cards, everytime i get suited cards.. the flop gives me two to go along with it and i never get any thing else and always get burned.. same with playing against people that i know are going for the flush, they always land it and i get burned.. ill never understand :(
 
zachvac

zachvac

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I hate suited cards, everytime i get suited cards.. the flop gives me two to go along with it and i never get any thing else and always get burned.. same with playing against people that i know are going for the flush, they always land it and i get burned.. ill never understand :(

If you are going for the flush, you have 9 outs, a little under 20% (4:1) on the turn or the river. Same is true of opponents. Bet more than enough to take away their odds to call (although if it's postflop and you suspect a flush draw bet more because you need to ensure you don't give implied odds either). When you're drawing make sure you have the odds to call. You'll miss over half the time, but so will your opponents. The frustrations you have are probably linked to the fact that flush draws most likely fold if they miss, thus you don't know they were on a flush draw. If you suspect a flush draw and the third of that suit hits, you need to be disciplined and able to lay it down or check-call rather than betting out and calling a raise.
 
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Berra2k

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well considering the odds of playing any 2 suited cards and catching a flush are very low, I'd say just keep playing solid and not to worry too much about people that fish like that. I think playing suited connectors isnt always a bad idea but most of the strategy depends on what the blinds are. If you keep playing solid and use your best judgement I'm sure more times than no you'll come out on top over the fish...
 
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CrawdadM16

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The bottom line is with the invention of online poker and televised tourneys, poker is a new game. Now, not only do you have to try and read what people may have, you have to be able to look into what people may possibly be drawing for. When these cards come out, run. This takes a lot of disciplined value betting. Get some chips in, see what and when your opponents will in fact call. Play it right, and there fishing can be your gain.
 
Cheetah

Cheetah

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I hate suited cards, everytime i get suited cards.. the flop gives me two to go along with it and i never get any thing else and always get burned.. same with playing against people that i know are going for the flush, they always land it and i get burned.. ill never understand :(

Maybe you should change seats with your lucky opponents. :laugh:
 
C

coljung

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Fukk, for the last couple of days, every single time i've gone all-in vs a flush draw, i've lost. And every fukking time i've gone all-in with a flush draw i've lost too.

Damn.

I know people say donks lose more often than not, but lately i keep getting rivered and outflopped and sucked out by them. No matter how weak or strong i play with them, sooner or later their luck ends up taking my chips.

Gotta take a small break again. :mad:.
 
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