Hi would just like some advice on how I played this hand and if anyone would do anything differently 50/£1 6 max I'm in the small blind with KK. It folds round to the Cut off who flats button folds and I make it £3.75 to go BB calls and cut off folds flop comes J 10 4 rainbow. I bet out £3.10 into 8.50 and get called turn bring a 6 and I fire again this time almost 70% pot again he makes the call river brings a 2 and this time I slow down and check and opponent bets £14. Hero?

Need to know the suits off the hand, but a small portion of the time you're losing to sets, and the suited (maybe offsuit) combos of JT. As played with your check against a more aggressive player I could see "bluff catching" with your KK overpair. Maybe an optimistic AJ is trying to get thin value out of you?

Can't remember the suits to be honest there wasn't any flushes that got there though. It turned out I made the call and he rolls over J10 off.

Except for the River call which I would suspect your behind and his bet pretty well proves it.

I would bet bigger preflop since you're going to be out of position and want to discourage the BB from coming along with trash like JTo as well as punish the limper?

A pair is a pair. The hand starts after the flop. Cash games are different than tournaments

Thanks think my problem is that I want action but it's just a bad run out if JQ had called there I'm probably getting 2-3 streets of value. I've not been getting any action with my premium holdings so made a discount to encourage it but ended up going against which was just unfortunate.

You need to clearly define "want action". You do not want more than one other person in the pot since your odds of winning significantly drop with more than one opponent.

I would bet the river, at all you played well.

Originally Posted by rmcneice

You need to clearly define "want action". You do not want more than one other person in the pot since your odds of winning significantly drop with more than one opponent.

Well obviously I'm not wanting a 5 way flop but it seemed like the last 5 or 6 premium hands I was just getting folds with I wanted one opponent in the pot

What had you observed about this player prior to the hand ? At low stakes, there are a lot of calling stations. So, I think your aggression pre-flop, post-flop and on the turn were OK. You were in a tough spot on the river. He called your bets on both the flop and the turn. However, you only had to call 14 for the chance to win around 50. I don't think there was a whole lot in his range that is going to be beating you, probably only TT/JJ/TJ. I'm not sure you could fold KK there. He could easily be value betting AJ/KJ/QJ, possibly even QQ.

for me when it is only caller or he has a set where he was simply looking for a flush that he decided to turn into bluff if he had touched his 10 or his J. the majority of the time he will also check a the river or put less expensive than $ 14.if he had had a pair prenieum preflop il would surely raise.

Originally Posted by domfudao

KK i play all in pre flop

What for 80bb? Your only going to get calls off AA or maybe QQ can't see AK or a lower pocket pair wanting to get amongst it for that many beavers. You don't want to scare everyone off do you

why did you check on the river? on this board without position we must bet 3-barrel for a value. call and see JTs-JAo.

Originally Posted by zekubiki

why did you check on the river? on this board without position we must bet 3-barrel for a value. call and see JTs-JAo.

I went into check call mode as I suspected he might be ahead but couldn't lay it down I didn't want to bet again get raised a be put in an even tougher spot was my thinking and with his exact hand I would of got raised I suspect

Originally Posted by Ianmacca99

Thanks think my problem is that I want action but it's just a bad run out if JQ had called there I'm probably getting 2-3 streets of value. I've not been getting any action with my premium holdings so made a discount to encourage it but ended up going against which was just unfortunate.

2 pair is harder to assume when no pair is on the board, and this type is the one most likely to beat us. After the flop the villain is definitely not folding top two pair. A straight is unlikely for him too as he would have had to be confortable calling your bets with a 3-5 hand Even if he had a J6, he would still be confortable betting into you top pair with the other card locked up in a pair. AA, JJ, JT, TT J6, T6, J4, T4, J2 and T2 are all good against pocket pairs and random Jacks or 10's. He might call with AJ, QQ, but I don't know if he would lead betting with them. Your bet sizing is a little smallish preflop, and quite small opening after the flop generally, but if you were attempting a slow play and keep the villian in longer it makes sense. You have great pot odds for every street you played, so it makes sense to call the river. However on the turn bet you did 70%, which is enough to cause many hnads to fold and the villian did not. He must percieve he has a made hand. Your decision to check the river seems okay if you trying to see if he had a hand good enough to lead the betting with, and then you fold, which he did, but you called. AA, a set of J or T, or 2 pair is what I expect if he leads on the river. The 3-5 is highly unlikely. Of course the villain could be a noob and is pushing with a random J, but we don't know that. I've had a top pair beaten many times this way (either to a 2 pair or a slow played set) that I am wary now with top pairs. All of that being said, KK wins enough of the time, and at no street was you odds bad, so you play is good here statistically. Situationally though, I would fold at the £14 bet. He has something, he called a pretty high bet and then led once he had the chance. Maybe a higher preflop bet of 4X or 5X would have him fold, but nothing you could have done post-flop was getting a fold from him. Your bets strategy then is to see whether or not you are beat. Your Turn strategy plus the check the river together followed by his lead bet was enough information. However if that was your strategy, it might be best to raise higher immediately post-flop, then check the turn. You'll find this information out sooner. For example if you had raised £5 after the flop, and he called a bet that size he has something. Then check the turn, and he leads then instead of at the river. You could fold at the turn with a smaller loss. If he checked, then you lead on the river, probably still losing less bezause you attempted to get information from him. Best to bet bigger earlier and get the info at the turn.

Originally Posted by sedlacekj

2 pair is harder to assume when no pair is on the board, and this type is the one most likely to beat us. After the flop the villain is definitely not folding top two pair. A straight is unlikely for him too as he would have had to be confortable calling your bets with a 3-5 hand Even if he had a J6, he would still be confortable betting into you top pair with the other card locked up in a pair. AA, JJ, JT, TT J6, T6, J4, T4, J2 and T2 are all good against pocket pairs and random Jacks or 10's. He might call with AJ, QQ, but I don't know if he would lead betting with them. Your bet sizing is a little smallish preflop, and quite small opening after the flop generally, but if you were attempting a slow play and keep the villian in longer it makes sense. You have great pot odds for every street you played, so it makes sense to call the river. However on the turn bet you did 70%, which is enough to cause many hnads to fold and the villian did not. He must percieve he has a made hand. Your decision to check the river seems okay if you trying to see if he had a hand good enough to lead the betting with, and then you fold, which he did, but you called. AA, a set of J or T, or 2 pair is what I expect if he leads on the river. The 3-5 is highly unlikely. Of course the villain could be a noob and is pushing with a random J, but we don't know that. I've had a top pair beaten many times this way (either to a 2 pair or a slow played set) that I am wary now with top pairs. All of that being said, KK wins enough of the time, and at no street was you odds bad, so you play is good here statistically. Situationally though, I would fold at the £14 bet. He has something, he called a pretty high bet and then led once he had the chance. Maybe a higher preflop bet of 4X or 5X would have him fold, but nothing you could have done post-flop was getting a fold from him. Your bets strategy then is to see whether or not you are beat. Your Turn strategy plus the check the river together followed by his lead bet was enough information. However if that was your strategy, it might be best to raise higher immediately post-flop, then check the turn. You'll find this information out sooner. For example if you had raised £5 after the flop, and he called a bet that size he has something. Then check the turn, and he leads then instead of at the river. You could fold at the turn with a smaller loss. If he checked, then you lead on the river, probably still losing less bezause you attempted to get information from him. Best to bet bigger earlier and get the info at the turn.

Thanks yeah looking back it should of been a fold I think I talked myself into believing I still could be good although a part of me felt I was beat too thanks for the advice mate