Bankroll building online Low limit NLHE

jazzaxe

jazzaxe

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I have read Chris Ferguson's excellent talk about bankroll building. His method for cash games is to never exceed 5% of your bankroll for a buyin and quit when you reach 10%. This works because it is safe. I like to move a little quicker so for better or worse I created a system for myself. My system incorporates a method to not only move up faster but to create a stop gap if you lose a stack. I start with 10% instead of 5% as a buyin. So I have 10 buyins available in my bankroll. I play a certain length of time such as 4 hours. I like a 4 hour block with occassional sitouts to stay fresh. My goal is to double my buyin within that time period. If I am successful I bank the profit and bank one half of it in my bankroll and put out 1/2 of my profit for the next session. So if I start at 100 buyin on session one and double to 200, I will buy in on the next session at 150. So my next buyin always will be 10% of my bankroll plus 1/2 of my last session's profit. If I lose my next buyin is 10% of my bankroll. I like this because it provides me a boost when I get hot and conserves my bankroll in a cold streak. I know a lot of guys like to keep 20 or 30 buyins in the kit, but I would rather redeposit if I get cold to keep me at a prescribed minimum buyin. If you go too low in buyin level it is tougher to get out because of the variance. It seems to work but I realize that doubling your stack is not automatic or by any means simple.
 
F

Fish

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Your theory is not a bad one at all.
The reason behind the 5% of the bankroll theory is to minimize your chances of going broke.
If you have the means to reload if you hit a rough patch, then your way is a much better way to go than the 'Ferguson' way.
 
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switch0723

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bad idea only having 10 buyins available, its very possible to go on 6-10 buyins lost streaks, even if your playing good poker. Youd be better off trying your same plan with 5% and then 7.5%.
 
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Toad

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I agree with switch...

10% is just a little too much IMO. If you play good poker then you will up to the next level in no time...and you will have the bankroll to back it up. I try not to get into the mindset of 'moving up fast'. In poker, patience equals profit.

I usually will buy in for 2-3% and then buy in for a full 5% on a higher limit table when I feel like I'm ready to move up. This keeps things interesting when I feel like I'm grinding at a lower level. It also allows me to get a feel for what play is like at the next level compared to where I am currently at without alot of risk.

In the past, I got into the habit of playing beyond my bankroll because I told myself "If I go broke I can afford to rebuy". If you are playing this way it is impossible to quantify exactly what your BR is because you can just keep going back to the well for more (and go back you will).

It's much easier (for me) to have a definite number I'm working with and play within that amount.

Just my $.02
 
eNTy

eNTy

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I'm confused, if you always re-buyin for 50% more then your previous buy in wouldn't that mean you have to move up really fast? You'd reach the buy-in max of your limit pretty fast then won't you ?

So you're plan is not to buy in for the full amount and go from there?
 
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danman7373

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I like your plan, although 10 buy-ins doesn't give you a lot of room for error. I also like how you have a way of riding the rushes and building quickly if the cards are falling your way. My only question is, what limit/blinds do you play? Say you buy-in with 100, are you sitting .50/1 with 100 BBs, or more or less?
 
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donkeykiller

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10 buy-ins is very bad way to go.

Pros wait till they hit 100-200 buy-ins at a certain level then move up buil;d it to requirement and move up when they reach the 100-200 buy-in level again.

For those of us like me and you that have jobs or business I would say we have the means to rebuy our bankrolls so a 50-100 buy-in rule can be ok

Even the best of the best go on bad streaks were they can lose 15-20 buy-ins before the cards turn back for them that why i say 50-100 buy-ins becuase that will give you room for varenice and also give you room for play style as well poker is very situational and if you have a LAG style instead of TAG style youll still have room and not go broke with the 100-200 buy-in rule .

Now if lost down to 75 buy-ins i would move back down and build back up till i had 100-200 buy-ins at next level , as you advance in limit your variance will be higher becuase youll met better and better players.
 
PokerVic

PokerVic

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I like your plan too.

Keep in mind, BR management is not only to keep you from going broke. It is also to keep you from backsliding. Playing too much BR can mean a good run goes to waste when it's immediately followed by a bad run.
 
jazzaxe

jazzaxe

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I like your plan, although 10 buy-ins doesn't give you a lot of room for error. I also like how you have a way of riding the rushes and building quickly if the cards are falling your way. My only question is, what limit/blinds do you play? Say you buy-in with 100, are you sitting .50/1 with 100 BBs, or more or less?

I play 4 tables for about 3.5 to 4 hours a session. Right now I am playing 3 tables of nickel/dime and one table of dime/quarter. I play full stacks at both levels and rebuy full when I fall below 90%

I started with nothing and have worked it up to $400.00. I have only been doing this for a short period of time, so I am going to follow up in a couple of weeks and see if it is continuing to work or if I need to adjust.
 
jazzaxe

jazzaxe

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Update on BR plan

play 4 tables for about 3.5 to 4 hours a session. Right now I am playing 3 tables of nickel/dime and one table of dime/quarter. I play full stacks at both levels and rebuy full when I fall below 90%

I started with nothing and have worked it up to $400.00. I have only been doing this for a short period of time, so I am going to follow up in a couple of weeks and see if it is continuing to work or if I need to adjust.

So far so good, my BR up to today is $607.00. Had two losing sessions this week, but the rest were all positive days. I usually have at least one double at one of the tables and usually have one negative table with other two generally above even. Had only one day of four positive tables. Definitely a grind but feeling positive.
 
eNTy

eNTy

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I usually have at least one double at one of the tables and usually have one negative table with other two generally above even. Had only one day of four positive tables. Definitely a grind but feeling positive.

So what happens when you double your buy-in in the course of the 4 hour session. Say you double it at the 1 hour mark. Do you then leave the table and join another or what ?

Also in your OP you stated that you would take 10% of your BR to buy in + 1/2 of the double up from the last session. So say you buy in with $10 and you double it. Wouldn't that mean you'd have to buy in with $15 the next session ?

Anyways good luck man it seems to be working, I only wish I had a BR like that. But then again I am the worst example of BRM you'll ever find :)
 
jazzaxe

jazzaxe

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Bankroll update

Yes I usually play out the win unless the game gets bad and I switch tables. I have been playing one full stack and then add a table with a short buyin if it works. The problem is that even with a stop gap on the loss side it is just as hard to win it back when you lose because your bets after a loss are smaller and 10% of a smaller bankroll is less to bet and less to win when you hit a big hand. This strategy worked real well for a couple of months but it went into the toilet the last half of May and all of June. See graph:
6mos.jpg
 
jazzaxe

jazzaxe

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Just made a graph on my experiment of Bankroll Building from zero. It took a year from freerolls to microstakes ring games. I have not won enough yet to get out of the micros, but this is all free money, no investment whatsoever. I have won most of the money on bodog, Full Tilt and Cake in that order.
I have a larger account at pokerstars which I have built up by depositing 20 buyins and building on that. My lesson learned is that it takes a while to build a bankroll from nothing and all of the hours played in freerolls could be better spent by making a minimum deposit every couple of weeks, win or lose. Like bringing in 50 bucks to play a friendly home game with your pals and leaving it in your cash account at the poker site.
I can then be adequately funded and can stop worrying about losing my bankroll in microrings. I think you can then play aggressively without worrying and that is the key to winning.
brollupdate.jpg
 
eNTy

eNTy

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Well at least u made up in august. Nice graph man.
 
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OmGiSAburel

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so u played 12 months and u won 200$ 12 MONTHS!? that's insane....

i think you should risk more of your money for your chance to double or even triple up your stack. i think in 1 year you had a lot of good days when you could build up faster your bankroll. Even so you respected a certain type of bankroll building so i congrats you.
 
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fothizz

fothizz

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the bankroll strategy is a good starting point for most of us. to add your insight and play your way is risky i think. my goal is to beat chis's record of 1 into 20,000. and also try and beat his current goal of o to 10,000.
 
Bankroll Building - Bankroll Management
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