Interesting Spot

B

Boomswitch

Rock Star
Joined
Apr 21, 2008
Total posts
217
I would like a step by step evaluation of what I should do in this scenario to get the most money out of the situation while I feel I have the best hand while at the same time not letting my opponents draw out on me. I find that situations like the one presented are one of the leaks in my game as I usually cannot get enough value out of hands like these...

Stats are really too early to make a judgment IMO but I will post them...

Hero is very TAG 11/8.3/2.7 over 17 hands
Sunderland4 is 22.2/16.7/0.5 over 17 hands
Clarry13 is 22.2/11.1/0 over 9 hands
Voyager is 24/2/0.8 over 50 hands

pokerstars Game #17139153944: Hold'em No Limit ($0.10/$0.25) - 2008/05/02 - 00:11:41 (ET)
Table 'Savo' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: INV@DER ($14.75 in chips)
Seat 2: Toyman ($37.95 in chips)
Seat 3: darklotus74 ($23.70 in chips)
Seat 4: smooke28 ($9.50 in chips)
Seat 5: GERDAHITMAN ($14.85 in chips)
Seat 6: VoyagerII ($21.15 in chips)
Seat 7: clarry13 ($5.65 in chips)
Seat 8: Hero ($40.80 in chips)
Seat 9: sunderland4 ($48 in chips)
INV@DER: posts small blind $0.10
Toyman: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [Jc Tc]
darklotus74: folds
smooke28: folds
GERDAHITMAN: folds
VoyagerII: calls $0.25
clarry13: raises $0.25 to $0.50
Hero: calls $0.50
sunderland4: calls $0.50
INV@DER: folds
Toyman: folds
VoyagerII: calls $0.25
*** FLOP *** [4c 7c 9c]
VoyagerII: checks
clarry13: bets $1
Hero: ???

What am I doing here? and why? please don't just say raise, fold, check etc. Explain yourselves please as I want to have some idea of your opinions.
 
SeanyJ

SeanyJ

Legend
Joined
Aug 21, 2007
Total posts
1,558
Ok well your sample sizes are pretty much useless other than on Voyager. Personally I would raise here because if someone has the A or K of clubs you don't want to give them a chance to hit it for cheap. Now you don't want to make a huge raise but you don't want to give anyone the right odds to chase, which could be difficult.

I think the pot has 3.35 in it, if I can add right. I would probably raise to about that, it commits clarry to the pot and gives sunderland the wrong odds to call but he still might. If any club comes that isn't the 8 you'd have a decision to make.
 
odinscott

odinscott

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Joined
Apr 4, 2008
Total posts
1,054
Well I probably call and wait to see (1) what voyager does, (2) what the turn brings, (3) what clarry does on the turn. For some reason I think that you are beat, or very close to it. The other option, which I wouldnt do with the J, maybe with Q and probably with K, but anyways the other thing that I could see, is a nice reraise, probably 3 bucks, to see where you are at. That would probably force the weaker guy to fold and save you if the other guy shoves. Again, with the J and not knowing the other 2 guys, I call, wait to see who does what and wait to see what the turn brings. Surely with a K or even Q in this instance it is alot different...

(Edit: I know alot of guys that simply wont fold a straight flush draw, thought I would mention that. Problem for me is that it only pays off once in a blue moon and you pay out all the other times. Figure I would mention if before someone else does though.)
 
tenbob

tenbob

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May 16, 2005
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Just raise, I argued before that slowplaying these type hands is a mistake. We can get no money in by checking to the river unless we are giving free cards to a straight draw, and in these type hands the naked Ac loves coming along for the ride.
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

Is drawing with AK
Joined
Jan 2, 2007
Total posts
8,819
We can't be afraid of a bigger flush here. It'll happen sometimes, but you'd be suprised what opponents will stack with on a flush board.

Guys, I think we can certainly consider calling. If we call, and sunderland has the ace of clubs, then he's getting 4.35:1 on his 1:7.3 draw. He's still making a big mistake. Keep in mind there's only 6 clubs left in the deck that can help him, and this is a pretty easy hand to get away from if a club comes off and he starts getting aggro.

However, that said, I still raise. :D If another club comes off the deck, we are getting nothing out of the rest of the opponents (unless we're beaten). And raising doesn't announced our hand like you'd think. So many bad players at this level will raise here with 2 pair/top pair because they're afraid of flushes drawing out on them.

The best way to get money out of the hands that we beat is a raise to 3$ here. And like others have said, the ace of clubs will likely come along for the ride anyways.

/me raises to $3
 
Last edited:
B

Boomswitch

Rock Star
Joined
Apr 21, 2008
Total posts
217
Part II of the Hand...

Not exactly the $3 bet that was suggested but I believe I played it close enough...

*** FLOP *** [4c 7c 9c]
VoyagerII: checks
clarry13: bets $1
finalhonor: raises $2 to $3
sunderland4: calls $3
VoyagerII: folds
clarry13: raises $2.15 to $5.15 and is all-in
finalhonor: calls $2.15
sunderland4: calls $2.15
*** TURN *** [4c 7c 9c] A♦


Alright what is the ideal play for the Turn?
Also I do have one thing of note, is calling here with J10 suited a mistake? Should I be raising it or fold pre-flop? or is the call okay?
 
SeanyJ

SeanyJ

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Joined
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Total posts
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Calling with J10s is fine when the guy min raises like that.

Anyways if I can add right the pot has $18.80 in it. And you have like $35 left, I'd probably bet about $13. If he re raises I'd call, if he calls I'd shove any non club river.
 
X

XXCardSharkXX

Guest
Joined
May 5, 2008
Total posts
1
With such a weak preflop raise, calling with JcTc in position on the raiser is fine if you have a nice passive table and can be fairly sure you're not going to get reraised behind.

You need to get the chips in the pot now. Top pair with Ac or Kc will come along for the ride and be drawing slim as will AA and KK with a club. The odds of there being a bigger made flush are slim and if you get stacked, so be it (the odds of a flush flop if two players are holding two cards of that suite is very small indeed). Get the chips in the pot now and bet good on the turn too and watch him come along or the ride with a bigger club.

If another club comes you should be very careful but that's not likely to happen as there are only 7 in the deck assuming he has 1 plus the 2 you have and the 3 on the board. If you slowplay this you let people possibly outdraw you and worse still you don't get the money in the pot when you almost certainly have the best hand.
 
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