[50nl 6max] AKs in 4-bet pot with fish

ChuckTs

ChuckTs

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Feb 2, 2005
Total posts
13,642
Villain is something of a maniac after a short 20 hands sample at ~50/20/2 and although I'm not sure what I was like at this exact table, I ran at 20/20/7 for the whole 6-tabling session if that helps...

Villain's been active, but I haven't seen many 3-bet or 4-bet pots involving him.

poker stars, $0.25/$0.50 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

BB: $87.10
UTG: $24.45
Hero (CO): $76.10
BTN: $51.40
SB: $51.95

Pre-Flop: A
spadenormal.gif
K
spadenormal.gif
dealt to Hero (CO)
UTG calls $0.50, Hero raises to $2.50, 2 folds, BB raises to $7, UTG folds, Hero raises to $22, BB calls $15

Flop: ($44.75) Q
diamondnormal.gif
5
clubnormal.gif
7
diamondnormal.gif
(2 Players)
BB checks, Hero ...

Can we c-bet (or shove?) profitably or do we give up and only continue if we hit an ace/king on the turn?
 
skoldpadda

skoldpadda

Caveman Eye Surgeon
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Mar 20, 2007
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Effectively $54 behind for each of you with a $44 pot. Basically any bet is pot committing. If you check he can effectively push you off the pot with any blank turn (and he probably knows this). If we put his 3bet calling range at top 15% of hands (reasonable for a maniac?):

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt
139,590 games 0.032 secs 4,362,187 games/sec
Board: Qd 5c 7d
Dead:
equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 46.175% 42.91% 03.26% 59902 4553.50 { AsKs }
Hand 1: 53.825% 50.56% 03.26% 70581 4553.50 { 77+, A7s+, K9s+, QTs+, JTs, ATo+, KTo+, QJo }

So you have about 46% equity vs this range. I think you can reasonably shove or check-fold the turn here. I'm not sure what is better, but based on the math a shove seems reasonable. But I don't think there is any real middle ground for a small bet in this situation.
 
C

Czech Razor

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Feb 2, 2008
Total posts
41
Villain is something of a maniac after a short 20 hands sample at ~50/20/2 and although I'm not sure what I was like at this exact table, I ran at 20/20/7 for the whole 6-tabling session if that helps...

Villain's been active, but I haven't seen many 3-bet or 4-bet pots involving him.

Poker Stars, $0.25/$0.50 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

BB: $87.10
UTG: $24.45
Hero (CO): $76.10
BTN: $51.40
SB: $51.95

Pre-Flop: A
spadenormal.gif
K
spadenormal.gif
dealt to Hero (CO)
UTG calls $0.50, Hero raises to $2.50, 2 folds, BB raises to $7, UTG folds, Hero raises to $22, BB calls $15

Flop: ($44.75) Q
diamondnormal.gif
5
clubnormal.gif
7
diamondnormal.gif
(2 Players)
BB checks, Hero ...

Can we c-bet (or shove?) profitably or do we give up and only continue if we hit an ace/king on the turn?
Your awkward raise to $22 given your stack size puts you in a tricky spot when you whiff the flop. I'd suggest re-considering how to play it pre-flop in future situations. As played shove.
 
S

switch0723

Cardschat Elite
Joined
Sep 2, 2007
Total posts
8,430
I havnt got much to add here since i see it as a definate shove after skolds look at the numbers. The only hands i see calling us are a,q or a loosly played k,q, so therefore shove here everytime.

I only really responded as i was questioning the post above, why has raising to $22 pre flop made this awkward?
 
WVHillbilly

WVHillbilly

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Nov 7, 2007
Total posts
22,973
I think the 4bet to $22 makes it awkward if we don't plan to push on the flop when checked to. Raising to $22 and then checking behind would be bad, IMO.
 
B

Bentheman87

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Sep 6, 2007
Total posts
794
He doesn't have AA or KK since he didn't put in another raise pf. I'd say he has QQ, JJ, 10 10, AK, or AQ. AK would fold, 10 10 and JJ might fold, AK would fold, so you could make some better hands fold by shoving so I think a shove is best. Only QQ or AQ would call you.
 
insolitude

insolitude

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Jan 2, 2008
Total posts
255
He doesn't have AA or KK since he didn't put in another raise pf. I'd say he has QQ, JJ, 10 10, AK, or AQ. AK would fold, 10 10 and JJ might fold, AK would fold, so you could make some better hands fold by shoving so I think a shove is best. Only QQ or AQ would call you.

And KQ?
 
zachvac

zachvac

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Sep 14, 2007
Total posts
7,832
He doesn't have AA or KK since he didn't put in another raise pf. I'd say he has QQ, JJ, 10 10, AK, or AQ. AK would fold, 10 10 and JJ might fold, AK would fold, so you could make some better hands fold by shoving so I think a shove is best. Only QQ or AQ would call you.

umm, news for you. AA and KK don't always raise to get their stack in preflop. I don't play 6max but I've noticed a lot of KKs and a few AAs simply flat calling 3 or 4-bets.
 
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