[50 NL] AT suited

[Chiefer]

see, i have to start paying more attention to this. i didn't even bother looking at the bets, just the results. he edited his post after i said dump it. so we were both right in a way.

agreed on the shove after the rereraise as he would be committed by then. learning this cash game stuff is throwing me for a loop. i am so used to tourny's that i'm having a really tough time. forgive me for my ignorance.

 

[GunslingerZ]

c9h13no3 and Chuck nailed the analysis.

Definitely shove the flop.

 

[ChuckTs]

learning this cash game stuff is throwing me for a loop. i am so used to tourny's that i'm having a really tough time. forgive me for my ignorance.

There are some huge differences chiefer, and it'll probably take a few thousand hands to get you on track to understanding them. It took me quite a while to get the hang of rings. Postflop play, stack size to pot size ratios, committedness....lots of interesting stuff

 

[jaketrevvor]

god given flop shove imo.

+ 2nd/4th posta is an obnoxious git. banhammer s'il vous plait.

 

[Effexor]

god given flop shove imo.

+ 2nd/4th posta is an obnoxious git. banhammer s'il vous plait.

+1

Ban this person.

 

[Chiefer]

There are some huge differences chiefer, and it'll probably take a few thousand hands to get you on track to understanding them. It took me quite a while to get the hang of rings. Postflop play, stack size to pot size ratios, committedness....lots of interesting stuff

i hear ya there. i only have a little over 5000 hands logged at .5/.10 at this point. i had a big run, then a 3000 hand downswing, now it's starting to pick back up. i have so much to learn!

 

[vanquish]

1. fistpump
2. shove
3. ?????
4. prophet
5. fistpump again
6. eat a pizza bagel

 

[zachvac]

Have to shove here imo. You're most likely the favorite at this point, and as mentioned a missed turn takes away that edge (favoriteness?) and a hit turn takes away the profit. Get the money in. If he folds you still win a decent-sized pot and if he calls you most likely are a favorite to win.

 

[dj11]

Fresh Caveat, I am not accomplished in the ring game. I'm fair in tourneys, but no real gem there either. I'm seeking insight here as to where/why my thinking is flawed. I'll add here that in a limit game this is the no brainer shove, bringing up still more interesting variations on a theme.

Keeping in mind the potential doom with this hand, perhaps you who advocate the shove, could expand using NON_ODDS based logic. And perhaps the different plays in a ring vs tourney mindset.

As I see it, with bottom pair, top kicker, flush and straight draws, this looks to be a good candidate to win a lot/ lose a lot. But with so many outs it is nearly psychologically impossible to drop this hand. Yes I know there are many who will tell us they can drop this hand in a heartbeat.

At this point in the hand tho we are still dreaming. I personally might be inclined to chase this gem, but I would prefer a bit of pot control.

Also no one has mentioned odds for villain holding K9 hearts or K9 no hearts, which could account for his raise.

 

[WVHillbilly]

I'm not sure what NON_ODDS based logic is but, if we push here 2 good things can happen:

1. We get our opponent to fold a better hand than we currently have (something like AJ/KQ/KJ)
2. We get our opponent to make a mistake by calling when we are a favorite to win.

Only if our opponent currently holds a set or a made straight is he not making a mistake by calling (and even then we have outs). Since we know that we win in Hold'em when we force our opponents to make mistakes doing that which forces our opposition to make them the most often is the right play. In this case pushing is the right play for that reason.

If we exercise pot-control, as you advise, and just call, we're likely to be the one making a mistake on the turn or we'll be giving our opponent the chance to NOT make a mistake on the turn if a scare card for him (good for us) hits.

BTW I would fold or just call in a tourney situation (assuming a healthy chipstack). Our edge is likely slim and we'd face elimination on a coin flip.