$5 NLHE Full Ring: JJ cbet?

MuscleMan76

MuscleMan76

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PokerStars - $0.05 NL (9 max) - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

CO: $3.88
Hero (BTN): $4.43
SB: $5.00
BB: $5.00
UTG: $10.13
UTG+1: $5.73
MP: $8.00
MP+1: $5.42
LP: $7.93

SB posts SB $0.02, BB posts BB $0.05

Pre Flop: ($0.07) Hero has J:diamond: J:spade:

UTG calls $0.05, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.25, fold, fold, UTG calls $0.20

Flop: ($0.57, 2 players) 7:diamond: A:club: 9:heart:
UTG checks, Hero ???
 
TylerN

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any stats on villain?
 
PattyR

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1.) SHAME ON YOU for not having 100BB stack!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

2.) stats would help.


however i bet flop to get dead moniez. if he calls your done on after streets
 
bgomez89

bgomez89

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check back flop, bet turn if he checks
 
KerouacsDog

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bet flop, if he calls, he probably has an Ace
 
LizaBuv

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Just Do It

Just covered stuff about CBetting in "Small Stakes No Limit Holdem". I think his advice here would be "Just Do It". You have position and he will probably let you know soon enough if he has the ace.
 
MuscleMan76

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With the check/call preflop, it looked like a medium strength A to me. That being said, it looked like a check/raise was coming. I guess I shouldn't take a smaller pair out of his range.

I really only had like 20 some odd hands on villain, so I can't really say anything about his play, though they were around 20/15, nothing really too extreme or able to make a read at all.
 
MuscleMan76

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Classic WA/WB https://www.cardschat.com/f49/wa-wb-concept-76525/.

Good flop to check back. You can bet the turn for value if they check again.

You can also call a turn bet because they can start value betting a whole range of hands here.


Wow, haven't seen that yet. That's extremely useful, thanks a lot.
That opens another question for me then: What happens when another over card hits the turn? Would I just reset with the check behind, if he checks? If he bets can I still assume that it's a call is good here?
 
PattyR

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Classic WA/WB https://www.cardschat.com/f49/wa-wb-concept-76525/.

Good flop to check back. You can bet the turn for value if they check again.

You can also call a turn bet because they can start value betting a whole range of hands here.

I wanna hear WVH give his response on this hand because i have seen him and chuck post the WA/WB theory on hands like these yet i have also seen them say its good to bet this type of flop. i know it depends on stats/villain/size/position but i'm a little confused on when to use WA/WB and when to collect dead money
 
brank

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Mostly its when you have position on villain. When OOP its depends on player type whether or not to bet. This is also quite a dry flop so we're not too worried many cards that can come on the turn.
 
PattyR

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Mostly its when you have position on villain. When OOP its depends on player type whether or not to bet. This is also quite a dry flop so we're not too worried many cards that can come on the turn.


yea this is the reason i figured you would want to bet the flop to collect dead money..b/c its a try board...but i dunno
 
cjatud2012

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Meh, this one is close because it's not clear if you're going to get called by worse and or if you'll fold better. But that doesn't mean you should never bet - you can still bet in situations like this if your opponent has a non-zero amount of equity in the pot, in order to "protect"/extract value/collect dead money. So is this one of those situations?

Let's think about what hands he could have in his range. He could have any pocket pair that's not already a set - if that's the case, he has 2 outs. What about a hand like KJ or QT? They both have 3 outs, plus a tiny bet more equity from running straight cards. Otherwise, random Kx or Qx have exactly 3 outs. 9x or 7x have 5 outs each. He could have some type of gutshot like JT which has 4 outs. If he has exactly KQ then he has 6 outs, which hits a quarter of the time. T8 would normally give him 8 outs which would give him about 2:1 equity, but we're holding 2 of his outs, so that drops to 3:1, same as if he had KQ.

So really, none of those hands are going to catch up that easily, especially not on just this next street. Looking at just the turn, assuming I'm not leaving anything out, in the worst case scenario the villain is going to catch up ~13% of the time. For that reason I'd say it's not really worth betting, cause you're not really afraid of what's going to hit the turn. That probably makes it a check.
 
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