$5 NLHE 6-max: Would you call with this hand in a multi-way pot?

J

JackOscar

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Obviously I would feel better about this fold if on the river one guy turned over AK and the other guy 7c8c (definitely not folding snug against MP next time I see him) but this was also the first time playing 5NL instead of 2NL so I didn't want to get out of line (seems to be business as usual here as well though).

Either way, would you call this pot sized bet here multi-way here with this hand that's not liable to improve on further streets on this semi-wet board? If the bet was smaller and the BTN folded I'm definitely calling but as is this seemed like way too much of a reverse implied odds type of hand.



888Poker Snap, Hold'em No Limit - $0.02/$0.05 - 6 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat

Angel_Maks (UTG): $5.00 (100 bb)
Jayy82 (MP): $4.86 (97 bb)
Fatco1a (CO): $8.84 (177 bb)
AndresJ (BU): $1.87 (37 bb)
Dodo1988 (SB): $1.75 (35 bb)
JackOscar95 (BB): $5.80 (116 bb)

Pre-Flop: ($0.07) Hero (JackOscar95) is BB with A T
1 fold, Jayy82 (MP) raises to $0.10, Fatco1a (CO) calls $0.10, AndresJ (BU) calls $0.10, 1 fold, JackOscar95 (BB) calls $0.05

Flop: ($0.42) A 5 6 (4 players)
JackOscar95 (BB) checks, Jayy82 (MP) bets $0.42, Fatco1a (CO) folds, AndresJ (BU) calls $0.42, JackOscar95 (BB) folds

Turn: ($1.26) T (2 players)
Jayy82 (MP) checks, AndresJ (BU) checks

River: ($1.26) 9 (2 players)
Jayy82 (MP) bets $1.30, AndresJ (BU) raises to $1.35 (all-in), Jayy82 (MP) calls $0.05

Total pot: $3.96 (Rake: $0.23)

Showdown:
AndresJ (BU) shows 9 9 (three of a kind, Nines)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 81%, Flop: 84%, Turn: 75%, River: 100%)

Jayy82 (MP) shows 3 3 (a pair of Threes)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 19%, Flop: 16%, Turn: 25%, River: 0%)

AndresJ (BU) wins $3.73
 
E

EarnDAStack

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I don't think you can fold on the flop. You basically flopped the best you could hope for, and BTN's range is going to be capped after flatting twice but MP could still have some higher aces and you may need to fold to some aggression from him on further streets. Also because of this I don't think you can raise flop but I could be wrong but I don't think it's ever a fold.
 
J

JackOscar

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I don't think you can fold on the flop. You basically flopped the best you could hope for, and BTN's range is going to be capped after flatting twice but MP could still have some higher aces and you may need to fold to some aggression from him on further streets. Also because of this I don't think you can raise flop but I could be wrong but I don't think it's ever a fold.


That's not true, every so often you're going to flop a set of aces or tens and even more often two pair all of which I'm continuing with here. I called pre-flop getting 12% pot odds, and with the two pot sized bets going on the flop you can make that 4% pot odds (and of course we expect to extract even more on the turn and river with a set). That's pretty close to the probability of flopping two pair or better with AT so I definitely would never say that we *have* to call the flop here in order to not be exploitable. There's plenty of better hands to call with here I think.

And I definitely think BTN could have flatted AJ and AQ but I'm more worried about either of them having sets or monster draws to be honest.
 
DrazaFFT

DrazaFFT

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you should topup to 100bb unle3ss youre intentionally play shortstack or midstack strategy.

other than you have no business involving in a multyway pot with ATo and OOP

please don't color code players it took me 3 reads to figure that you've folded flop
Im OK with a flop fold, you've seen a cheap flop that you could've exploit, sadly that hand is not much of a potentially but if you've flopped trips or two pairs you would've stack both probably short stack fish and the other guy...

This way, fold flop is good for us. IMHO of course
 
E

EarnDAStack

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That's not true, every so often you're going to flop a set of aces or tens and even more often two pair all of which I'm continuing with here. I called pre-flop getting 12% pot odds, and with the two pot sized bets going on the flop you can make that 4% pot odds (and of course we expect to extract even more on the turn and river with a set). That's pretty close to the probability of flopping two pair or better with AT so I definitely would never say that we *have* to call the flop here in order to not be exploitable. There's plenty of better hands to call with here I think.

And I definitely think BTN could have flatted AJ and AQ but I'm more worried about either of them having sets or monster draws to be honest.



So your plan is to flop trips and stack someone OOP multiway on either a AAx or TTx board but you think BTN could still have AQ so flopping AAx would be worthless anyways and you're afraid of the draws which is where you get all of your value from?

:hmmmm2:

Goodluck
 
J

JackOscar

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So your plan is to flop trips and stack someone OOP multiway on either a AAx or TTx board but you think BTN could still have AQ so flopping AAx would be worthless anyways and you're afraid of the draws which is where you get all of your value from?

:hmmmm2:

Goodluck



If 2 aces hits the board the chance that BTN has AQ is drops to half.
 
U

UkoChebuko

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Well played...
You can't call OTF. Not vs this size. You can use Equilab to see. You even don't have the equity to call. I am pretty sure. And you are OOP....Also there is a rake. Vs pot size bet easy fold. For me...Preflop can be squeeze, but...little weak. I will use ATs, AJo. Can be profitable squeeze ATo, but I prefer call here.

Also you can't lead (donk bet). If it was T65 , when OK, 40-50% bet is possible. As "donk bet". But on A65 check-fold. Vs pot size bet...In theory you can't make a "donk bet" even at T65, because TT is 100% in your squeeze range. But whatever, NL5...On Ax boards they will raise sometime, as bluff. But this will be very rare. As pure bluff...But still, you will fold...I mean some equity loss. With this line.
 
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J

JackOscar

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Well played...
You can't call OTF. Not vs this size. You can use Equilab to see. You even don't have the equity to call. I am pretty sure. And you are OOP....Also there is a rake. Vs pot size bet easy fold. For me...Preflop can be squeeze, but...little weak. I will use ATs, AJo. Can be profitable squeeze ATo, but I prefer call here.


Thank you, I agree this is right on the edge of where I won't squeeze I think and I am getting too good odds to ever fold this pre from the BB so facing this pot sized bet I'm just playing the hand the same way I would play it if I had J8o. Random flop of 2 pair or set and I'm taking all their money, otherwise I am done with this hand facing pot sized bet and call.
 
U

UkoChebuko

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When you think about some hand , to call or not, vs more players, the "nutty" potential matters the most. For ATo this is KQJ straight. Also in this board high sets, two pairs are possible (even the offsuit combos are here like "always"), T9s is possible, even T9o. What's why I will call even vs 3x. But I will fold with A9o. Vs 3x MP + 2 callers. Without some "special" info. Vs min raise I will call with very wide range. At this limit. Even hands like 65o, 73s, 32s, K6o. 60% + range...I mean vs MP 2x + two callers. From the BB...

And you must be very carefull at AAx boards. It is not so profitable. They have the highest kickers. The lowest are from suited combos..
 
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F

fundiver199

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I think, this is a good fold in the long run. Heads up it would be a pretty mandatory call, but in a 4-way pot the value of a hand like top pair meh kicker goes down, and someone else has called already, which mean, that if you call as well, the pot size will quickly be spiralling out of control. Of course its always a little bitter to then see their hands and realise, that one of them was on a wild bluff, and the other called with a hand worse than yours. But you did not have that read, when the hand was played, and in the long run you made the right decision, while they did not.
 
Z

zuker

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In 4-way spot i would continue if i have (double pair)++
 
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