$2 NLHE 6-max: Post- flop situation: A raise is followed by a re-raise to all-in.

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ronn6583

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pokerstars Zoom, Hold'em No Limit - $0.01/$0.02 - 6 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat - https://www.cardschat.com/replayer/624TECN8f

UTG: $2.73 (137 bb)
MP: $6.25 (313 bb)
CO (Hero): $1.05 (53 bb)
BU: $2.00 (100 bb)
SB: $2.39 (120 bb)
BB: $2.13 (107 bb)

Pre-Flop: ($0.03) Hero is CO with 7♥ A♣
UTG raises to $0.05, MP calls $0.05, CO (Hero) folds, 1 fold, SB calls $0.04, BB calls $0.03

Flop: ($0.20) Q♠ 9♥ 8♠ (4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets $0.10, MP calls $0.10, SB raises to $0.30, 2 players fold, MP raises to $6.20 (all-in), SB calls $2.04 (all-in)

What hand does the SB raise with?
What hand does the MP re-raise to all-in with?
Is it possible here to bluff from a player with MP?
 
E

eetenor

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PokerStars Zoom, Hold'em No Limit - $0.01/$0.02 - 6 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat - https://www.cardschat.com/replayer/624TECN8f

UTG: $2.73 (137 bb)
MP: $6.25 (313 bb)
CO (Hero): $1.05 (53 bb)
BU: $2.00 (100 bb)
SB: $2.39 (120 bb)
BB: $2.13 (107 bb)

Pre-Flop: ($0.03) Hero is CO with 7♥ A♣
UTG raises to $0.05, MP calls $0.05, CO (Hero) folds, 1 fold, SB calls $0.04, BB calls $0.03

Flop: ($0.20) Q♠ 9♥ 8♠ (4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets $0.10, MP calls $0.10, SB raises to $0.30, 2 players fold, MP raises to $6.20 (all-in), SB calls $2.04 (all-in)

What hand does the SB raise with?
What hand does the MP re-raise to all-in with?
Is it possible here to bluff from a player with MP?


Thank you for posting

This is a good range analysis hand We reverse engineer the hand based on all actions
We take the actions of each player and determine the frequency of them playing each hand in this manner.

Example
Seat 5 willing to get all-in on this flop.
Range=
JT nuts preflop call? Yes post flop jam yes
but smooth call opener then jam? This is a draw heavy board that connects well to the openers range it is more +ev to raise the nuts here than smooth call. At this buy-in level some players lack the experience to raise here.

Second nuts QQ preflop call? Not often
99 88 maybe?
Q9 Q8 98 smooth call then jam not often.
AsKs preflop call? Not often. Flop call Original bettor then get all-in? Not often.

Taking the time to continue the analysis will improve your range reading skills. Please share your efforts if you wish. I will answer any questions you may have about how to do a thorough break down.

Hope this helps
:):)
 
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Sidetracked

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I don't think that trying to assign rational and 'good' thought processes to this player pool is necessarily very productive.

At $2 NL, the majority of the player pool doesn't play rationally, or particularly well. Either of these players could have had anything from a naked flush draw to the nut straight.
 
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fundiver199

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I don't think that trying to assign rational and 'good' thought processes to this player pool is necessarily very productive.

At $2 NL, the majority of the player pool doesn't play rationally, or particularly well. Either of these players could have had anything from a naked flush draw to the nut straight.

I agree with this. Trying to put other players on a range in a hand, we did not even play, is definitely overthinking the situation at 2NL. The backraise from MP is a pretty weird line, but who knows, what kind of hands a bad player might be doing this with. Could be the flopped straight, that he was trying to slowplay, or could be some kind of draw, that he wanted to see a cheap turn with, but facing the raise he changed his mind and decided to turn it into a bluff. The only thing, we can say for sure, is, that both MP and SB probably have some piece of the board. Even bad players are typically not stacking off for 100BB with absolutely nothing.
 
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eetenor

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I don't think that trying to assign rational and 'good' thought processes to this player pool is necessarily very productive.

At $2 NL, the majority of the player pool doesn't play rationally, or particularly well. Either of these players could have had anything from a naked flush draw to the nut straight.


Thank you for posting.

By increasing our ability to data collect we improve our ability to play, that is always productive especially versus V that play wide ranges aggressively. One way we data collect is by understanding the common actions that a player pool use and the frequency of their use.

Understanding rational and good thought processes is the base line from which we then measure our villains tendencies. A great example of this is learning GTO ranges first and then adapting our ranges to non-GTO villains.

So while you are correct that the players in this hand may not be good or rational, how would the OG poster know this if they do not know what good in this spot would be?

Prior to internet training the best way to learn poker was to break down a hand you did not play at a live table. The players who did this made millions from what they learned.

:):)
 
R

ronn6583

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TURN: Tc
RIVER : [Qs 9h 8s Tc] [3d]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
SB: shows [9s 9d] (three of a kind, Nines)
MP: shows [Js Th] (a straight, Eight to Queen)
SB check-raised the flop. This is usually played with a strong hand.
I thought he had a set or a straight, but when MP answered all-in decided that SB still had a set and should fold.
Earlier, I had to fold a set because of a bad board.
https://www.cardschat.com/replayer/124TEfMpK
Bluffs work if your opponent misses or doesn't like the hand.
But if there is a hit the bluff does not work. There is no point in bluffing against the check-raise line.
 
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