$2 NLHE 6-max: Nut flush is flopped. Can you fold here?

[Coinuss]

PokerStars - $0.02 Ante $0.01 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 190.5 BB
SB: 100 BB
BB: 59 BB
Hero (UTG): 275 BB
MP: 194.5 BB
CO: 122.5 BB

6 players post ante of 0.5 BB, SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 4.5 BB) Hero has A♣ T♣

Hero raises to 3.5 BB, MP calls 3.5 BB, fold, fold, fold, BB calls 2.5 BB

Flop: (14 BB, 3 players) K♣ 8♣ 3♣
BB bets 1 BB, Hero raises to 3 BB, MP calls 3 BB, BB calls 2 BB

Turn: (23 BB, 3 players) 3♦
BB bets 1 BB, Hero raises to 4 BB, MP raises to 19 BB, fold, Hero calls 15 BB

River: (62 BB, 2 players) 6♦
Hero checks, MP bets 60 BB, Hero calls 60 BB

I think the villain may have a pocket pair, 3x. I'm scared of his 88s. I know when paired a board is probably a full house here. His turn 4-bet show strength but I cann't fold. Was my gaint mistake slowplay flop?

 

[vinnie]

It would be nice to see even the basic stats for MP and BB.

I am very confused about your bet sizing here, especially on the flop and turn. This is $2NL and players are weak calling stations (usually, although you don't provide any stats for these players). With antes, you could probably be raising 4.5-5.5 preflop. I don't absolutely hate 3.5, but I like to charge the bad players more.

After the BB donks 1xbb on the flop, a pot sized raise would be to 17xbb. You have the board crushed, so full pot might not be wise, but still 9-10xbb would be better. And, if you raise to 10xbb and MP calls then you have a much better idea of what they might hold. Raising the 3xbb accomplished nothing and offered 6-1 odds to MP and better to BB. If either of them have a set, they need only 5.7-1 to call. Throw in some implied odds and they can easily call correctly with two pair as well.

Turn is similar, the only thing that makes it even slightly confusing is the weak bets from BB and you. Turn raises are almost always very strong hands. The only semi-bluff hand that I could reasonably see here would be AK with the Ace of clubs, and you block that. This is always going to be a flush, trips, or a boat. And, it's probably not trips or a small flush. At worst, it is going to be a Q-x flush. Considering how small the bet is, I probably end up calling this with the plan of check-folding the river (expecting most flushes and trips to check it behind).

River, we check and he goes for a full pot sized bet. That's a boat, at least 95% of the time and probably 100% at this limit. Turn 3bet bluffs that are followed by river pot-sized bluffs just aren't things at $2NL. Every step of the way you have made it seem like you had something. He is hoping you have something strong enough to call.

You haven't given us any stats. So, I can't say which boat he likely showed up with. 88 seems likely, KK and 33 seem less likely. If they are a very loose fish, maybe he had K3s or 63s or evenn 83s. I would be a little shocked to see 66, but I expect to see 66 more often than I see a smaller flush.

$2NL is a fairly easy game. Value bet often, value bet on the large side, slow-down and give up when the loose-passive players play back at you. They have hands.

 

[Aballinamion]

PokerStars - $0.02 Ante $0.01 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 190.5 BB
SB: 100 BB
BB: 59 BB
Hero (UTG): 275 BB
MP: 194.5 BB
CO: 122.5 BB

6 players post ante of 0.5 BB, SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 4.5 BB) Hero has A♣ T♣

Hero raises to 3.5 BB, MP calls 3.5 BB, fold, fold, fold, BB calls 2.5 BB

Flop: (14 BB, 3 players) K♣ 8♣ 3♣
BB bets 1 BB, Hero raises to 3 BB, MP calls 3 BB, BB calls 2 BB

Turn: (23 BB, 3 players) 3♦
BB bets 1 BB, Hero raises to 4 BB, MP raises to 19 BB, fold, Hero calls 15 BB

River: (62 BB, 2 players) 6♦
Hero checks, MP bets 60 BB, Hero calls 60 BB

I think the villain may have a pocket pair, 3x. I'm scared of his 88s. I know when paired a board is probably a full house here. His turn 4-bet show strength but I cann't fold. Was my gaint mistake slowplay flop?

I don't play tables with ante, but lemme give a try. I think that OTF we have some hands that could be re-raising, but we are out of position most of times and without any flush.
The best hands are the flushes and the sets, that could be raising OTF, but given the fact the player in the blinds is a recreational, no problem.
Now, when MP raises OTT, it is trying to represent another lower flush and just a few combos with hands as 88 and 33.
However, if Villain/MP really had the Full-House, it would be raising OTT? Considering this is a fast-fold table, the opponent called preflop, it can be a lot of things, including A3, back door flushes, etc.
IT sucks a lot but I don't think we can be folding in this situation. IF MP has the combos of 33 and 88, good for it, c'est la vie (it is life).

Regards;

Carlos 'Aballinamion' Barbosa

 

[Coinuss]

It would be nice to see even the basic stats for MP and BB.

I am very confused about your bet sizing here, especially on the flop and turn. This is $2NL and players are weak calling stations (usually, although you don't provide any stats for these players). With antes, you could probably be raising 4.5-5.5 preflop. I don't absolutely hate 3.5, but I like to charge the bad players more.

After the BB donks 1xbb on the flop, a pot sized raise would be to 17xbb. You have the board crushed, so full pot might not be wise, but still 9-10xbb would be better. And, if you raise to 10xbb and MP calls then you have a much better idea of what they might hold. Raising the 3xbb accomplished nothing and offered 6-1 odds to MP and better to BB. If either of them have a set, they need only 5.7-1 to call. Throw in some implied odds and they can easily call correctly with two pair as well.

Turn is similar, the only thing that makes it even slightly confusing is the weak bets from BB and you. Turn raises are almost always very strong hands. The only semi-bluff hand that I could reasonably see here would be AK with the Ace of clubs, and you block that. This is always going to be a flush, trips, or a boat. And, it's probably not trips or a small flush. At worst, it is going to be a Q-x flush. Considering how small the bet is, I probably end up calling this with the plan of check-folding the river (expecting most flushes and trips to check it behind).

River, we check and he goes for a full pot sized bet. That's a boat, at least 95% of the time and probably 100% at this limit. Turn 3bet bluffs that are followed by river pot-sized bluffs just aren't things at $2NL. Every step of the way you have made it seem like you had something. He is hoping you have something strong enough to call.

You haven't given us any stats. So, I can't say which boat he likely showed up with. 88 seems likely, KK and 33 seem less likely. If they are a very loose fish, maybe he had K3s or 63s or evenn 83s. I would be a little shocked to see 66, but I expect to see 66 more often than I see a smaller flush.

$2NL is a fairly easy game. Value bet often, value bet on the large side, slow-down and give up when the loose-passive players play back at you. They have hands.

https://www.cardschat.com/replayer/424CP3lGY
This is truly the best analysis I've ever read. I do not like cash games, but I like ZOOM. I play cash to make a CARDHUNT call, but in the end I have -6 $ in the game and + 0.2 $ for the call. I started collecting statics from yesterday, and unfortunately, I do not have statistics for these players. I don’t understand what people are doing on 2NL, but I see this strategy here more predictable. The nuts are on the flop, and I did not understand the 1bb bet. I will correct the pre-flop and flop bet size, thanks. It’s a pity I can’t put more than one likes for reply

 

[vinnie]

It is totally fine to be a new player. And, it does take a while on zoom to get stats on the players. Against unknowns, I use population stats. And most 2NL players are loose passive (with random maniacs that show up from time to time). Now, it has been ages since I played fast poker regularly. To give you an idea, it was 25-50NL on Full Tilt before black Friday. So, it is possible the 2NL zoom population is significantly different from the 2NL normal tables, but I can't imagine they would be that much better.

One thing that dominates 2NL (and can frustrate people to no end) is that the players call with anything. But, that passivity also means they don't bluff scary boards often enough. So when they start playing back, they think they have a great hand. Beating it can be very easy but boring. Wait for good hands, bet them hard unless you get pushed back at.

Treat minbets on the flop, turn, and river as checks (until you have a player specific read that says otherwise).

 

[Dkerridge14]

PokerStars - $0.02 Ante $0.01 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 190.5 BB
SB: 100 BB
BB: 59 BB
Hero (UTG): 275 BB
MP: 194.5 BB
CO: 122.5 BB

6 players post ante of 0.5 BB, SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 4.5 BB) Hero has A♣ T♣

Hero raises to 3.5 BB, MP calls 3.5 BB, fold, fold, fold, BB calls 2.5 BB

Flop: (14 BB, 3 players) K♣ 8♣ 3♣
BB bets 1 BB, Hero raises to 3 BB, MP calls 3 BB, BB calls 2 BB

Turn: (23 BB, 3 players) 3♦
BB bets 1 BB, Hero raises to 4 BB, MP raises to 19 BB, fold, Hero calls 15 BB

River: (62 BB, 2 players) 6♦
Hero checks, MP bets 60 BB, Hero calls 60 BB

I think the villain may have a pocket pair, 3x. I'm scared of his 88s. I know when paired a board is probably a full house here. His turn 4-bet show strength but I cann't fold. Was my gaint mistake slowplay flop?

Yeah I think you’ve identified the problem yourself. With that many players on the flop you want to be betting massive. You could even overbet which I would like in this position because at these stakes, sets are going to call almost regardless. To the question you asked though, with the line this hand has taken then yes you can fold quite comfortably pointless throwing your money away. Highly unlikely that it’s worse jamming. Only worse flushes on minimal probability