10NL JJ

Richyl2008

Richyl2008

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Just joined the table recently so no reads. Seemed like kind of a weak fold but i'm not sure what i'm hoping for on this flop other than a set. Were both full stacked so even if I have an overpair on the flop theres still 3 pairs that beat me that are in most players 3 betting range and being out of position just makes it worse imo. How do I play this here and whats the plan on the flop if we decide to call?

poker stars, $0.05/$0.10 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 9 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter
BTN: $11.80
SB: $5.55
BB: $6.45
UTG: $9.60
UTG+1: $11.60
UTG+2: $4
MP1: $3.60
Hero (MP2): $11.15
CO: $11.25
Pre-Flop: J:diamond: J:heart: dealt to Hero (MP2)
4 folds, Hero raises to $0.40, CO raises to $1.20, 4 folds
Results: $0.95 Pot
CO mucked and WON $0.95 (+$0.55 NET)
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

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In general, out of position against an unknown, I'm usually going to call this both for set value and for immediate value, and I'm pretty much just trying to get to showdown postflop. Folding is out of the question without some good reads.

But ya, a little hard to give advice in such a general situation. Overall I'm just looking for a cheap showdown here after I call this pf.
 
BelgoSuisse

BelgoSuisse

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Nov 26, 2007
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Folding is really weak here. At least call for set value. But it's not even obvious you are behind. I think half the time you're up against AK/TT instead of QQ+.
 
F Paulsson

F Paulsson

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I agree that not calling for set/seeing what develops post flop is a bit weak, but I have to give you credit for thinking it through - and although most experienced players will snap call this raise, there's not THAT much money to be won. If you stack him every time you hit a set, you're getting just the right price to continue, but the times that you don't hit a set, you'll end up folding the best hand a lot of the time and just generally have a case of reverse implied odds.

I agree that it's a call, but it's not a terribly expensive fold to make, either. And if anything, I really like that you took position into account before folding.
 
W

wsthesis

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Jul 21, 2007
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1. Call. See a flop. Without any reads, i'd probably consider a continuation bet depending on the board.
2. 3-bet - a good play - raise to about 3.50 and see what happens. If he flat calls, consider betting non ace boards.
 
SavagePenguin

SavagePenguin

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[echo]Call for set mining purposes[/echo]

He either has A/Q+ or a bigger pair.
You're ahead of the former, and if he has one of the latter you have a good chance of playing for stacks on a J-high flop. People have a hard time folding overpairs.

I'd call pre-flop, and lead out $1.70'ish with any non-Ace flop.
I fold to a re-raise at that point, and try to see a showdown cheap if he calls.
 
WVHillbilly

WVHillbilly

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It's not a bad fold OOP. You're not getting the implied odds I'm looking for to set mine (12:1 or better) but it's close and the chances of winning the hand unimproved with your jacks make me call here.

You do need to keep an eye on this guy though. I know that if I see a player routinely make a standard opening raise and then fold to a 3bet, I'll certainly widen my 3betting range. I mean there are times when you absolutely need to fold to a 3bet after opening but to me holding JJ isn't that time.
 
widowmaker89

widowmaker89

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How do you figure he isnt getting 12:1 implied odds? Also why are you using 12? I dont disagree I usually want both to have 20x the raise which we dont here to set mine but I am not following your math here. I do call though and hope for a cheap showdown since JJ may be winning in addition to the set value.
 
WVHillbilly

WVHillbilly

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