Would online poker be fairer without Huds?

hello, you as well as akkari and other professional poker players also think online poker would be fair to both regular and recreational players without the Huds on the tables? I would like to have the opinion of everyone, because this was one of the most controversial subjects I have seen in the last few days..

agree very controversial; all sites do not allow computerized tools (AI), but many allow huds and work closely together with big data and tracker companies.

Of course it would be fairer without HUD's it not even an argument.

Think about it from this perspective take one of your parents. 50's or 60's probably richer than you. If they play a $5 tournament they have no idea that every other player they are playing has detailed information on how they play after a certain amount of hands. They don't know that HUD's exist, they don't know what HUD stands for. They are playing thinking everyone is just playing their cards without additional information. Most if they realized it is what it is in the poker world, they would never play again. If you told 100 older players what they were playing against, a ton of them would not play again.

I personally don't use a HUD, I suggested to party poker last year, I would be fine with a HUD if there was an indicator besides each player that was using a HUD. Then I would know that my opponent thinks I play a certain way according to their HUD and I could use that to my advantage. All of a sudden HUD's become less valuable.

I get that when you are playing 12 tables that it's pretty much impossible to keep track of everyone and a HUD is very useful. I don't care games are getting tougher and everyone should be trying to make games softer for everyone's sake. Especially people that if they knew that everyone at the table but them was using a HUD they would think they are being cheated, because it is unfair.

I believe that players must have equal conditions for the game. But players who buy special programs get an advantage. It is better to make Hud embedded in the poker client. But much worse for the industry is the botnet networks that work without Hud.

To be honest i like the session only stats that party poker uses only a few basic stats like vpip/pfr/3bet are of any real use as you only have small samples which restart at the beginning of each session. Any indepth analysis or notes have to be done in live play and cant be done from your database after sessions as villains names arent visible. The database is only of use to review your own game away from the tables but still gives the basic stats as a visual indicator of player types over each session while in live play.

Using filters in tracking software to review your hand histories is a great way to improve your play.

Some very well respected people in CC argued in the past that not allowing huds would result in a flood of bots/illegal huds.
Maybe the rooms should provide the ''HUD'' statistics in the client for all players.

yes i don't think they should be used. tracking your hands for studying purpose and knowing if player x folds often are different.

What does fair have to do with anything? With or without HUD's players with more skill, better discipline, etc., etc. will have an advantage over the less skilled, disciplined, etc., etc., doesn't seem fair does it? Best thing would be for the game to be played, then total entry fees-rake would be divided equally among all entrants, can't get any more fair than that. Really exciting too. No satties allowed, cause someone getting into the game for less money than someone else wouldn't be fair & we can't have that. Enjoy.

You should be way more concerned about bots. Hud battle is going to be a 50/50 battle, I would be happy to know I am not getting cheated.

It would be a lot fairer if there wasn't any HUD's in online poker. Everyone would be on an even playing field. You would only be able to take notes on other players at your table to get info on them.

I personally dont care for a HUD and would not have a problem it they were not used. I just wished all sites would allow some other way to track my own stats and hand histories. I like to look over what I have done at times after I play a tournament.

It would not change anything bad players will still play bad and good players will still play good.

Most offer it in some way. It is just it is extra work on some that you have to ask them to send it to you.

The top sites have it in there chat box and you can request reports with a few clicks without having to ask support.

ken nielson said:

I personally dont care for a HUD and would not have a problem it they were not used. I just wished all sites would allow some other way to track my own stats and hand histories. I like to look over what I have done at times after I play a tournament.

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I am in favor of banning and forbidding all HUDs and helping programs and tools . Some players have them some don't , some have these , some have those , not fair , at live poker I believe you are not permitted to carry such helping tools or charts . As for the argument that this ban will have as a result players to use illegal programs and tools , I really doubt it will happen , they will be caught , get banned and funds get seized . Moreover , this is a challenge for pokerrooms to prove the worth of their security teams .

In today's world, skill is no longer an asset. People cheat their way through everything and rely on what they are told. Heaven forbid anyone has to depend on their own faculties to achieve anything. In a way, HUDs make it more fair for the masses with zero skill. In doing so, however, skill is removed and poker morphs into a completely different contest.

I use a hud, but I would prefer it wasn't allowed. I believe it would be more fair. I think it's valuable to have a database to analyze your game after, but with no information on particular players during the session. That being said, I would be sad to let go my beautiful customized hud that took me so long to develop

andosalado said:

I use a hud, but I would prefer it wasn't allowed. I believe it would be more fair. I think it's valuable to have a database to analyze your game after, but with no information on particular players during the session. That being said, I would be sad to let go my beautiful customized hud that took me so long to develop

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Me too, with the hud we can see the fish more easy

Of course it will be more fair. But is that the question? Isn’t the real question “is it right?” I will probably use any tool that’s available when I get more serious. Until I am told to stop. As far as I know, those tools are available to everyone who goes and gets them. If you choose not to use them, that’s your choice. How do you fault others for using a tool that helps them when you could go get the same tool. Not much of a debate to me.

How do you fault others for using a tool that helps them when you could go get the same tool. Not much of a debate to me.

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I think the problem is that many people aren't even aware of that kind of tools, and that lack of knowledge creates an unfair situation. If poker sites allow the use of huds, and even work with the companies that creates them, there should be a disclaimer to online poker newbies that this thing exists. After that is up to them if they want to use it or not.

Mr_Hand said:

Of course it will be more fair. But is that the question? Isn’t the real question “is it right?” I will probably use any tool that’s available when I get more serious. Until I am told to stop. As far as I know, those tools are available to everyone who goes and gets them. If you choose not to use them, that’s your choice. How do you fault others for using a tool that helps them when you could go get the same tool. Not much of a debate to me.

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HUDs should not be allowed IMHO. Why, because poker is a game of skill not a computer game. If I walked into a casino with a database on my phone of known players and there tendencies or betting habits/situations I would be thrown out immediately.

I think HUDS and poker sties online profiles should be totally banned. If you want to play poker against a computer then play but you should know you are playing against a program database. Right now there is no regulation so it is hte Wild West is a computer AI program

jfitzg414 said:

HUDs should not be allowed IMHO. Why, because poker is a game of skill not a computer game. If I walked into a casino with a database on my phone of known players and there tendencies or betting habits/situations I would be thrown out immediately.

I think HUDS and poker sties online profiles should be totally banned. If you want to play poker against a computer then play but you should know you are playing against a program database. Right now there is no regulation so it is hte Wild West is a computer AI program

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This is why I said the real question is whether you think it is right or not. Not if it’s fair. I’m sure there are plenty of people on both sides. I totally see your point and I understand where you are coming from. But the fact is, right now it’s allowed. If you want the same advantage, you are welcome to it. If not, you are welcome to lobby to have it changed. But for me, as long as guns are allowed, I’m not coming to the fight with a knife.

Mr_Hand said:

This is why I said the real question is whether you think it is right or not. Not if it’s fair. I’m sure there are plenty of people on both sides. I totally see your point and I understand where you are coming from. But the fact is, right now it’s allowed. If you want the same advantage, you are welcome to it. If not, you are welcome to lobby to have it changed. But for me, as long as guns are allowed, I’m not coming to the fight with a knife.

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Sure it is not fair and you can lobby all you want but with no regulation what forces the site to do anything about it. NOTHING except to walk away from the site that is the strongest lobby.
As far as the knife and gun metaphor my alternative is to not enter the fight at all and find a fairer fight

jfitzg414 said:

Sure it is not fair and you can lobby all you want but with no regulation what forces the site to do anything about it. NOTHING except to walk away from the site that is the strongest lobby.
As far as the knife and gun metaphor my alternative is to not enter the fight at all and find a fairer fight

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I’ve been away from poker for quite a while. So forgive my ignorance, but are there sites that don’t allow Poker Tracker and the like? I used to play on Fulltilt and Stars. I used Poker Tracker on both. Has this changed? I just thought they were all allowed.

i think availability of auxiliary software does not matter. relying on skills and luck