Originally Posted by Eclipsenz
I wouldnt raise pocket 66s 3bb like you are saying I would shove that is a hand that needs to be protected,
But if im in lp and have aq or the like what is the point of shoving, only too gain 300 chips or so, is what I'm getting at, I'm happy to take the risk if my stack has an edge on the whole table. or adjust my raises accordingly so if a person does call I know precisely what range to put them on and adjust accordingly. Bear in mind this is if I am big stack if I'm average or below I am playing shove/fold/ basicly under 10bb or 15bb in certain cases where there are fishy bigstacks.
The way I said sigh is cause it seems where the type of play you are implying is when blinds get to 100/200 you are utg you'd shove AJ wouldn't ya? which to me is wrong especially if you are big stack. I mean it pays off.. for what 300 chips? what if it goes wrong.. and oh does it go wrong as running into a Ace with higher kicker, or pockets even leaves you screwed doesn't it, when blinds are 150-300 I'm shoving much wider. but 100/200 to me when you are sitting on 3k+ no need to get panicky
Would I shove AJ UTG with 15bb at 100/200? No, I'd probably fold. Would I shove AJ with 15bb at 100/200 from CO instead of raising? Sure, because 66% of the time I will miss the flop, and if I c-bet and get raised on a low board, assuming I have two live overcards I'd just give myself odds to call him off and have enough equity, which seems awfully foolish - almost like trying to get it in behind?
Sounds like you've got a case of monsters under the bed syndrome. Shoving 15bb from LP with AQ is fine, and you will get called off with worse a lot of the time. When you do get called you are normally flipping, and even if they have you crushed you probably have 30% equity at worst. If they've got aces, tough, gg. It's about ranges, not about the odd time someone has something better.
If you have AQ UTG with 15bb, do you raise/call, raise/fold or shove? Clearly, raise folding seems bad because AQ is super strong, especially with 15bb, so we can discount that I hope? If you are raise/calling (to 3x pre, then calling the jam) do you think he'll shove worse than AQ over a large UTG raise? On the other hand, jamming UTG with not all that many chips, do you think he'll call AJ/AT/KQs? If you want the answer, it's yes. Additionally, if they do have something like AT, a low flop comes, and you c-bet then they fold, you are losing a ton of value if they would have called pre.
Originally Posted by /Logan/
[X] I think you are wasting your time Pascal
[X] He can play like he want (don´t tap..)
[ ] Oz and Pascal are fishies, don´t pay attention to them.
Meh I learnt a ton of forums, might as well try and give some back, plus I enjoy debates
And what's the big difference between SNG 9mans and when you are deep in tournaments? Unless you are talking about doing this stuff for ICM reasons, in which case you are burning tons of money raise folding to 3x when raising to 2.1x would have the same effect