Was there any way out of this?

piggiepoker

piggiepoker

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Just went from 1st to 14th in an ultra deep SCOOP. Any way out of this hand?

pokerstars Hand #153208262447: Tournament #1563334954, $150+$12 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level XI (500/1000) - 2016/05/12 16:27:47 WET [2016/05/12 11:27:47 ET]
Table '1563334954 2' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: cope769 (65246 in chips)
Seat 2: mjw006 (50000 in chips)
Seat 3: russkoeradio (28543 in chips)
Seat 4: mauserFFM (49640 in chips)
Seat 5: piggiepoker (155788 in chips)
Seat 6: zÿax (136822 in chips)
Seat 7: CHELitw (117763 in chips)
Seat 8: Respect_Lt (46250 in chips)
Seat 9: milionmaster (54976 in chips)
cope769: posts the ante 125
mjw006: posts the ante 125
russkoeradio: posts the ante 125
mauserFFM: posts the ante 125
piggiepoker: posts the ante 125
zÿax: posts the ante 125
CHELitw: posts the ante 125
Respect_Lt: posts the ante 125
milionmaster: posts the ante 125
mauserFFM: posts small blind 500
piggiepoker: posts big blind 1000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to piggiepoker [Ks Kh]
zÿax: folds
CHELitw: raises 1000 to 2000
Respect_Lt: folds
milionmaster: folds
cope769: calls 2000
mjw006: calls 2000
russkoeradio: folds
mauserFFM: folds
piggiepoker: raises 4000 to 6000
CHELitw: folds
cope769: calls 4000
mjw006: calls 4000
*** FLOP *** [2s 2c 3d]
piggiepoker: bets 21625
cope769: calls 21625
mjw006: folds
*** TURN *** [2s 2c 3d] [Qs]
piggiepoker: bets 38000
cope769: calls 37496 and is all-in
Uncalled bet (504) returned to piggiepoker
*** RIVER *** [2s 2c 3d Qs] [8d]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
piggiepoker: shows [Ks Kh] (two pair, Kings and Deuces)
cope769: shows [3c 3h] (a full house, Threes full of Deuces)
cope769 collected 139867 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 139867 | Rake 0
Board [2s 2c 3d Qs 8d]
Seat 1: cope769 showed [3c 3h] and won (139867) with a full house, Threes full of Deuces
Seat 2: mjw006 folded on the Flop
Seat 3: russkoeradio (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: mauserFFM (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: piggiepoker (big blind) showed [Ks Kh] and lost with two pair, Kings and Deuces
Seat 6: zÿax folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: CHELitw folded before Flop
Seat 8: Respect_Lt folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: milionmaster folded before Flop (didn't bet)
 
Everybodylovesdeuces

Everybodylovesdeuces

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I don't understand why you raise so small pre flop and then over bet the pot post flop. I think those should have flipped around. Maybe you have some stats on cope but I'm not sure that everyone is getting it in there with 44-JJ. So when he calls your huge overbet some alarm bells should be going off if he's a normal player. Being so deep stacked I would rather play small ball. You could have made a small be on the flop of 1/2 pot of something like 9k and maybe checked the turn and then bet the river. Try to think about stack sizes and manipulate your opponent so you keep the pot small when you want to and big when you have a big hand (more than one pair). He's probably trying to get it all in, and you're probably call. But you at least have a chance to get away rather than just barreling like crazy at it. All you do is make worse hands fold and better hands call.
 
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WiZZiM

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it's pretty much a cooler for around 60bb, it's going to be really hard to find folds here without any reads, with a solid read on the player you can make folds here but you havent supplied any info. but yeah in general i'd like to see a little more preflop in your raise maybe to 8-10k or something, postflop a half pot bet would suffice as this flop is very much a WA/WB situation, meaning pot control has more merit as there is less you can get value from. Having said that, he will call flop with pretty much any overpair, so there are hands you still get value from.

For the most part you expect folds here on the flop so once you are called it's an opportunity to slow things down and pick off bluffs on rivers or keep the pot smaller for when you are behind.

having said all this it's really easy to say as we know he hit a monster, so next time post your hands so you don't post the results of the hand.

i heavily agree with the above post, especially this " All you do is make worse hands fold and better hands call."
 
T

trent32la

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Raise more preflop, against a minraise + 2 overcalls, raising 6bb is wayyy too small here this deep. I would probably make it ~9k here.

Bet smaller on the flop, potting here looks too strong and this board is not scary. I would bet 1/2 pot on the flop.

Check the turn. There are really no scary river cards, and we want to look as weak as possible. When jamming this turn, we are rarely getting called by a better hand. Obviously this is just a cooler.
 
BentleyBoy

BentleyBoy

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Yup. I tend to agree that your pre flop bet was wayyyyyyy too small. This allowed both of the other players into the flop,really cheaply. Around 3 or 4 to 1 odds. Easy calls as they had already invested in the hand. Had you raised much higher, then you may not have had to worry about the post flop issues (would the player with 33 have called a higher raise?)..... But in reality that is where the game really starts.

Having been presented with the flop, bet sizing is now key, as others have commented. Did you consider that the fact the villain called your raise may suggest he had some kind of hand? He has now invested about half of his stack into this pot. That should be telling you something. Having acknowledged this, your turn bet / action may be different. Remember, your hole cards are only brilliant pre flop..... That's why your pre flop bet should have been bigger..... Unless you were effectively slow playing (and the. Got caught out!)

All these considerations go together to help us read the game better and help us not to lose so much in such situations....and win more by preventing such situations.

BB
 
J

JPainTrainSicko

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Agree with what everyone else is saying. Raise more pre given the pot size and action. Then smaller on the flop. Not sure this would change how things played out for you. But it's something to think about for the future.
 
J

joe777

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By raising bigger pre i.e 9-12k you could probably denied the villain odd to set mining even with small pair.Some players tend to set mining with 5-10%(depends on raiser tendencies) of effective stack sizes.So by only raising 6k,you are still giving the villain the correct odds to call.
 
piggiepoker

piggiepoker

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All great suggestions, thanks yall!!
 
MoryMorte

MoryMorte

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Definitely raise more pre flop and bet less post flop.
He is not going to pay you with a lot of worst hands. Even if you bet the flop and get called you need to slow down because if you are ahead you won't loose that hand up to river!
 
D

Dan Lucas

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I think the only thing at this stage you could have done is all-in pre-flop or fold. I know this seems like stupid advice, but without knowing players, I would expect that unless you made a huge over-bet pre-flop, with 65 big blinds, cope 769 is probably going to set mine if he/she isn't all-in pre-flop. You bet a dry board for value and got unlucky. Unless you can read minds or predict the future, the way this hand played out is pretty much a cooler as WiZZiM said, and his advice is dead on. Gl next time around.
 
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