Seeking advice on live tourney play I made today

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Eager2improve

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I played a live KO tourney today and I'm wondering how I could have played this hand or how I should play it different in a non KO tourney or cash game.

Feedback would appreciated. Thank you.


Started with 6k chips. Blinds up to 100/200 by the time I reached first playable hand.

UTG limps. It gets folded to me. I look down at a pair of 9s and make a 3x BB raise.

The button and UTG limper both come along.

Flop 4-9-J rainbow

UTG leads out 400, I min raise to 8 and get called by both players.

Turn comes a blank, I bet about half the pot and get called by both players again.

The river comes another blank so at best my opponents have probably have two pair or a strong pair. I decide to move all in, after all, it is a KO tourney.
Yet I don't get called.

Should I have just value bet? Should I have checked the flop and/or turn and let them try to muscle me?

I called with suited connectors and a few small pairs while I could get in cheap during the remainder of the first three rounds, never coming close to using 20% of my stack size on speculative hands.

Got JJ once but no action. I ended up getting blinded through over 2 rounds more until I was at the 10BB mark with blinds at 1k/2k.

Should I put my tourney life on the line earlier by bullying pots in late position to pick up some extra blinds so that I'm not so short stacked when the cards are running good?
 
IamRude

IamRude

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I don't think you could've gotten more action out of 9's, but I would have thrown a value-bet instead of jamming.
Considering theyre calling to streets, theyre probably just really bad.

On the later stages, maybe your playing a little to tight, and thus getting blinded out/not being called with your big hands.

There are generally 2 theories of thought in how to play poker tournies.
1. Tight is right
2. Get in cheap while you can and see many flops

Its really what works for you/how it fits the style of playing field.
I think one thing I've learned in poker is you really have to change your strategy and playing styles consistently dependent on how the rest of the field is playing.

For you, maybe its opening up your range in later stages?
 
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mig2169

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I have played in many live ko tournys here in LA, if find that if u think about ko's it will hurt ur game. Yep u could of bet for value and maybe u get called, but most likely u don't so all in was one move, maybe not the best, but if u do get called u might be beat. jjj
 
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The_Pup

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Welcome to our circle, E2I. I like your question because it is about live play and a hand you won - most players seems to forget these hands and worry about the hand where a Q comes on the river and the villain makes trip queens. Also, I suspect not getting full value from the winning hand is a weakness in my game.

Anyway, to your question. We are often left with a sense of wondering what would have happened if we did anything different - for example, if we get 2 calls from a value bet we wonder if it could have been bigger. In this situation we probably have the best hand and might realistically be putting the villains on drawing hands or AJ/KJ type hands. We should be worrying about JJ and need to decide from the play/tells whether this is realistic. If both players have been on draws the only way we can get more chips is for them to bluff. Think about a min bet - this can have some value here because it is hard to fold to it as they look a bit foolish and often cannot resist the temptation to have a go.
 
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dafootster

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Depends if you think you had made the decision to get all your chips in regardless...that is if you had of value betted, and we're raised, would you have called? A value bet would probably guarentee more chips in, and perhaps encouraged someone to come over the top with the 2nd best hand. In any case, you came out with a healthy pot and didn't have to show your trips, which is a good thing too.
 
Poker Orifice

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I played a live KO tourney today and I'm wondering how I could have played this hand or how I should play it different in a non KO tourney or cash game.

Feedback would appreciated. Thank you.


Started with 6k chips. Blinds up to 100/200 by the time I reached first playable hand.

UTG limps. It gets folded to me. I look down at a pair of 9s and make a 3x BB raise.

The button and UTG limper both come along.

Flop 4-9-J rainbow

UTG leads out 400, I min raise to 8 and get called by both players.
I'd be more apt to raise to ~3x his bet, or 1050 at the very least (it is player read dependant.. & what our image is on the table)
Turn comes a blank, I bet about half the pot and get called by both players again.
seems reasonable... part of why I'd raise more on the flop is... the 400 bet is real small & min-raising to 800 is still pretty small compared to size of the pot.
Typically when I'm in a hand (w monster) I'm trying to look ahead in hand, making an effort to get as much into the pot as poss. (ie. if I can size my bets to set up a river shove... bonus! In this hand you'll easily be able to set this up as your stack isn't very deep at all.
The river comes another blank so at best my opponents have probably have two pair or a strong pair. I decide to move all in, after all, it is a KO tourney.
Yet I don't get called.
So there's like 10,500 (<?) in the pot, you shove the remainder in your stack (2,600-ish?)... but they don't call?? Seems odd that you wouldn't get called here.
Should I have just value bet? how could a value bet be any smaller than ~1/4 pot that it was? I mean a 1/4pot bet would typically look like a suckbet on the river if you all were alot deeper. So I really can't see how you could bet any less here in this spot.
Should I have checked the flop and/or turn and let them try to muscle me? You can't 'check' the flop if utg has already bet (I'm assuming you meant.. 'should I just call' the flop') - player read dependant imo. ie. today, one of the tourneys I was in I got involved in a hand that was an unraised, multi-way pot... I had 62o in BB and got to see the flop for free! Yay me! I flop a gutter & 4players check. I turn the straight (well-disguised) and lead out.... 1 player calls. My history with this guy is.... he will always try to steal a pot & commonly bets POT or even overbets on river. So in this case I obviously check the river & of course he bets out with an overpot shove allin... I callzz... 'gg' him. (< player read dependent as are all/or most hands)
I called with suited connectors and a few small pairs while I could get in cheap during the remainder of the first three rounds, never coming close to using 20% of my stack size on speculative hands.
20% of your stack... calling with speculative hands is ALOT imo. At worst I'd be looking at stacks needing to be 10x the size of the bet... but you typically would want to be getting 15to1 to setmine w sm pp's. (I rarely deviate from 15to1.. only occassionally will call iwth 10to1.. partially depending upon reads of villain & table image)We're roughly 8to1 to flop the set but to even out the times we aren't able to stack villain, we should really be looking at stacks being ~15x the size of the preflop bet
Got JJ once but no action. I ended up getting blinded through over 2 rounds more until I was at the 10BB mark with blinds at 1k/2k.

Should I put my tourney life on the line earlier by bullying pots in late position to pick up some extra blinds so that I'm not so short stacked when the cards are running good?

Not sure what the structure of the tournament is so it's kinda hard to say. Myself I'm looking for spots to resteal-shove over an overly aggress LP player who seems to be opening quite often. This is a great way to pick up chips if it's difficult to find spots to steal blinds on your table.
 
Poker Orifice

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One thing to consider when betting on the river & considering size of the bet (something I read before.... I think it was Phil Gordon)... this is for tournament situation (while stacks are fairly deep). Villain will often be willing to call a river bet equal to roughly half of their remaining stack, or a bit less.. (psychologial reasons.... "I still have chips to play.... hmm.. I callzzz")
 
Poker Orifice

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Reading this post & one of the comments above on it (from 'The_Pup') has gotten me motivated to pull a few HandHistories out & post them with analysis (I've got a HUGE collection of them, lol.... anytime I get in a hand & think that I may have wanted to play it differently (for whatever reason, usually obviously to get more value... or to lose less). I've got some good examples that due to history with villain it can really alter how I believe I should play the hand.
Will post tomorrow... it's getting awfullly late here.
(hint... some of them are from Cardschat Tournaments!).
 
spunka

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flop is 4-9-J rainbow and 2 blanks hit, now if your opponents did miss completly they won't call, they need to have something to call you with, an A, K or a Q on the board might have done the trick. Not many hands over their chips or call a huge bet if the have nothing.

You chance here is to try to make them play back at you (act a bit weak) and then maybe they will try and bluff you out of the pot.

You're simply acting too strong, and also you have a strong Image "Blinds up to 100/200 by the time I reached first playable hand" in fact you're a ROCK ;-) and a rock will only get action from very strong hands.
 
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